bambooculm Senior Member Joined: 16 Jul 2007 Posts: 11 Location: Sydney Australia Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Breville BES860 Barista... Grinder: Sunbeam EM0480 Drip: Braun Roaster: Dog Bowl and Heat Gun
Posted Tue Jul 17, 2007, 5:28am Subject: Re: Cafe Culture Downunder by George Sabados
The paragraph titled 100% espresso is 100% pretentious garbage. The majority of Australian coffee drinkers drink instant coffee, or filtered or brewed coffee. Australians love McDonalds, Pizza Hut, Burger King, Hungry Jacks, etc. and a lot of restaurants serve filtered American style coffee. That is the plain truth.
After World War 2, Australians developed a taste for American style coffee which was percolated or brewed, and before instant powdered coffee became popular, they used a liquid coffee essence which was diluted with hot water.
In Sydney town, which is Australia's most cosmopolitan city, espresso coffee is also popular, especially with the Italian community. The majority of Australians however, are actually tea drinkers who prefer weak instant coffee. Lebanese style coffee is also popular, as there is a large Lebanese community. The people of Lebanese descent outnumber the Italians. Lebanese style coffee is made from dark roasted caramel arabica beans, ground extra fine like talcum powder and brewed in a stove top coffee pot with a lot of sugar. Sydney's first real coffee shop of any note was Repins which sold American style brewed or percolated coffee. Filtered coffee became very popular in the 1970's and 1980's, and remains very popular.
If anyone doubts what I say, I would suggest that they walk into any supermarket in Australia with eyes wide open, and look at the coffee shelves. Almost all of the coffee available is instant coffee, and there will be a small section with medium roast pure coffee, and a small section with dark roast pure coffee. The people who enjoy espresso are not the majority among coffee drinkers. The part of George's rave that is true, is that Australians prefer milk based coffees, even the Italian Australians like milk based coffees. The black coffee fans are the Lebanese coffee drinkers, and they drink Lebanese style coffee, which is not espresso.
pstam Senior Member Joined: 27 Jan 2004 Posts: 2,305 Location: Beijing Expertise: Professional
Espresso: ECM, SAN MARCO, EURO 2000 Grinder: MAZZER Vac Pot: YES Drip: YES Roaster: YES, HOME STYLE
Posted Tue Jul 17, 2007, 8:56pm Subject: Re: Cafe Culture Downunder by George Sabados
bambooculm Said:
The paragraph titled 100% espresso is 100% pretentious garbage. The majority of Australian coffee drinkers drink instant coffee, or filtered or brewed coffee. Australians love McDonalds, Pizza Hut, Burger King, Hungry Jacks, etc. and a lot of restaurants serve filtered American style coffee. That is the plain truth.
After World War 2, Australians developed a taste for American style coffee which was percolated or brewed, and before instant powdered coffee became popular, they used a liquid coffee essence which was diluted with hot water.
In Sydney town, which is Australia's most cosmopolitan city, espresso coffee is also popular, especially with the Italian community. The majority of Australians however, are actually tea drinkers who prefer weak instant coffee. Lebanese style coffee is also popular, as there is a large Lebanese community. The people of Lebanese descent outnumber the Italians. Lebanese style coffee is made from dark roasted caramel arabica beans, ground extra fine like talcum powder and brewed in a stove top coffee pot with a lot of sugar. Sydney's first real coffee shop of any note was Repins which sold American style brewed or percolated coffee. Filtered coffee became very popular in the 1970's and 1980's, and remains very popular.
If anyone doubts what I say, I would suggest that they walk into any supermarket in Australia with eyes wide open, and look at the coffee shelves. Almost all of the coffee available is instant coffee, and there will be a small section with medium roast pure coffee, and a small section with dark roast pure coffee. The people who enjoy espresso are not the majority among coffee drinkers. The part of George's rave that is true, is that Australians prefer milk based coffees, even the Italian Australians like milk based coffees. The black coffee fans are the Lebanese coffee drinkers, and they drink Lebanese style coffee, which is not espresso.
Thank you very much for your supplement to the article of George.
I know that many people do not trust me, but I would tell some of our understanding for your reference. You can think about it if you like. If not, just forget it.
It is quite similar to China, people prefer to drink milk based coffee drinks, as well as for *$s. People always say that their local people prefer that, but I do not believe it. The main reason for this is due to the low quality of the espresso drinks. If the espresso was not well made, it can be much was than filter coffee. So people call it not-drinkable.
For most cafes, the espresso was not good and not drinkable. If much more milk is mixed, it could be drinkable, even if not taste good. In this case, the only way to drink is to mix with a lot of milk.
But, if the espresso can be made rather good, not talking about god shot, people will like it and drink it. As I said long before, the espresso in Pass By Bar is only around good, very few can be very good. But, the sales is still very good for pure espresso. It is only because that they are our clients, and we provide technical support. We can not fully control it. So, it can be just around good standard. Some times, a little awya from it, but not too far.
Recently, some of cafes opened by our trainees, and I try to help them to keep a higher standard for espresso drinks, in the cafes which I can have more power of control. I hope that some of them can be kept at excellent level. For example, one of them is Tarot Cafe, which is not far from Pass By Bar.
If some of you have got a chance to be in Beijing, you can try it there.
Peter in Beijing ------------------- http://www.kaffa.cn/ ------------------- I am looking for the way and the place to extend our trainning courses.
Philosopher Senior Member Joined: 13 Feb 2007 Posts: 188 Location: Australia Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: Silvia Grinder: Rocky
Posted Tue Jul 17, 2007, 9:43pm Subject: Re: Cafe Culture Downunder by George Sabados
bambooculm Said:
The majority of Australian coffee drinkers drink instant coffee, or filtered or brewed coffee.
espresso coffee is also popular, especially with the Italian community. The majority of Australians however, are actually tea drinkers who prefer weak instant coffee. Lebanese style coffee is also popular, as there is a large Lebanese community.
At home: Most people drink instant. When using 'fresh coffee' most people opt for supermarket brick ground or beans. Most common preparation methods are drip filter or plungers (maybe moka pots). People with some dosh invest in an espresso machine but usually the department store variety - e.g. Krups, Sunbeam, DeLonghi. There probably is a degree of ethnic variance e.g. Lebanese, Greek going for the Turkish style and Italians opting for the Moka pot. I think cultural diversity and younger population is diluting the English heritage of tea drinking so it hard to talk about 'typical'
Eating out: Espresso machines seen ubiquitously in cafes and restaurants but quality is quite variable. Drip method seen mainly in cheaper take-away establishments or large conference centers where there is high volume.
Specialty coffee: Well respected small community with some industrious and passionate people. Making only limited inroads either into the average cafe or domestic front
Rob_O Senior Member Joined: 28 Jul 2007 Posts: 1 Location: Devon Expertise: Just starting
Posted Sat Jul 28, 2007, 9:27am Subject: Re: Cafe Culture Downunder by George Sabados
bambooculm Said:
The paragraph titled 100% espresso is 100% pretentious garbage. The majority of Australian coffee drinkers drink instant coffee, or filtered or brewed coffee. Australians love McDonalds, Pizza Hut, Burger King, Hungry Jacks, etc. and a lot of restaurants serve filtered American style coffee. That is the plain truth.
After World War 2, Australians developed a taste for American style coffee which was percolated or brewed, and before instant powdered coffee became popular, they used a liquid coffee essence which was diluted with hot water.
In Sydney town, which is Australia's most cosmopolitan city, espresso coffee is also popular, especially with the Italian community. The majority of Australians however, are actually tea drinkers who prefer weak instant coffee. Lebanese style coffee is also popular, as there is a large Lebanese community. The people of Lebanese descent outnumber the Italians. Lebanese style coffee is made from dark roasted caramel arabica beans, ground extra fine like talcum powder and brewed in a stove top coffee pot with a lot of sugar. Sydney's first real coffee shop of any note was Repins which sold American style brewed or percolated coffee. Filtered coffee became very popular in the 1970's and 1980's, and remains very popular.
If anyone doubts what I say, I would suggest that they walk into any supermarket in Australia with eyes wide open, and look at the coffee shelves. Almost all of the coffee available is instant coffee, and there will be a small section with medium roast pure coffee, and a small section with dark roast pure coffee.
I think the writer was refering to what people drink in cafes, not what people drink at home or in McDonalds. I found it to be true whilst over there, can't even remember seeing filter coffee. Working in Sydney most people drank espresso when they could but obviously you can't leave work/home every couple of hours so then instant or tea is more practical...! Although even the offices in Sydney all have coffee shops..
pstam Senior Member Joined: 27 Jan 2004 Posts: 2,305 Location: Beijing Expertise: Professional
Espresso: ECM, SAN MARCO, EURO 2000 Grinder: MAZZER Vac Pot: YES Drip: YES Roaster: YES, HOME STYLE
Posted Sat Jul 28, 2007, 9:41am Subject: Re: Cafe Culture Downunder by George Sabados
Rob_O Said:
I think the writer was refering to what people drink in cafes, not what people drink at home or in McDonalds. I found it to be true whilst over there, can't even remember seeing filter coffee. Working in Sydney most people drank espresso when they could but obviously you can't leave work/home every couple of hours so then instant or tea is more practical...! Although even the offices in Sydney all have coffee shops..
It seems that you have warmer of hot water, and yoyu can drink tea from time to time. While in Italy, they can have any water only when a break and then go to a cafe, in their working places or close to. Every a couple of hours, they go to cafe for a break, and mostly have a caffe.
In a train, they drink instant coffee, but most people do not drink because in most railway station, there are some cafes and most people can have a cup of espresso there. If I really want a cup of coffee when I was in a train, I can only have instant coffee, instant espresso. But not in any other places.
Peter in Beijing ------------------- http://www.kaffa.cn/ ------------------- I am looking for the way and the place to extend our trainning courses.
JasonBrandtLewis Senior Member Joined: 9 Dec 2005 Posts: 6,099 Location: Berkeley, CA Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Elektra T1 - La Valentina -... Grinder: Mahlkönig K30 Vario -... Vac Pot: Yama 5-cup Drip: CCD, Chemex Roaster: No, no, not another...
Posted Thu Jan 7, 2010, 12:39pm Subject: Re: Cafe Culture Downunder by George Sabados
bambooculm Said:
The paragraph titled 100% espresso is 100% pretentious garbage. The majority of Australian coffee drinkers drink instant coffee, or filtered or brewed coffee. Australians love McDonalds, Pizza Hut, Burger King, Hungry Jacks, etc. and a lot of restaurants serve filtered American style coffee. That is the plain truth.
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