chrisb Senior Member Joined: 15 Dec 2004 Posts: 3 Location: Melbourne Australia Expertise: I love coffee
Posted Tue Jan 22, 2008, 8:25am Subject: Re: Ascaso Steel Duo Espresso Machine
I have had significant problems with leaking from the steam thermoblock on the "trio pm". Despite being repaired it is again leaking (well it never really stopped. Waiting on parts currently with a underpowered steam wand :(
iZappa Senior Member Joined: 14 Sep 2006 Posts: 129 Location: Norway Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Isomac Millenium Grinder: Anfim Haus, Ascaso i-2,... Drip: French press will do Roaster: Gene Cafe
Posted Tue Jan 22, 2008, 8:35am Subject: Re: Ascaso Steel Duo Espresso Machine
I have had significant problems with leaking from the steam thermoblock on the "trio pm".
Is this the two-group with one thermoblock? If so, do you use it in a home setting (+- 1 liter milk a day) or in a commercial setting (2 liter ++ milk a day)?
The reason I ask is that I have encountered similar problems with the thermoblock. That was in a commercial setting (very small cafe). My theory is that it should not be used for such big quantities of milk a day. The gaskets can't take it and the thermoblock itself gets heavy damages from such constant use.
I maybe wrong and hope others will chime in who have used these machines with heavy use of the thermoblock.
chrisb Senior Member Joined: 15 Dec 2004 Posts: 3 Location: Melbourne Australia Expertise: I love coffee
Posted Wed Jan 23, 2008, 5:08pm Subject: Re: Ascaso Steel Duo Espresso Machine
While I never really need the two group with the thermoblock at home, It was purchased at a significant discount. The unfortunate side is that yes it is not seeing heavy duty. I can confirm that it is a damaged gasket on the thermoblock which is causing the problems.
MarkPrince Moderator Joined: 19 Dec 2001 Posts: 5,462 Location: Vancouver, BC Expertise: Professional
Espresso: KvdW Speedster Grinder: Compak K10 WBC Vac Pot: A bit too many Drip: Clive Coffee Drip Stand Roaster: Hario Glass Retro Roaster
Posted Fri Feb 13, 2009, 2:48am Subject: Re: Ascaso Steel Duo Espresso Machine
It's been a long time since I wrote the first look for this espresso machine.
It's been out on the test bench and in the kitchen now for several months, getting a serious working over. I've compiled a lot of tests with the machine, and had two test groups in (3 consumers, 2 consumers + two pro baristas) to use the machine.
I was planning on having this as one of the 'launch' Detailed Reviews for the new CoffeeGeek site, but since the ETA on that is still at least 3 months away, and possibly longer, I'm toying with the idea of publishing it sooner.
The problem is, if I do that, I'll have to write up two complete Detailed Reviews - the new website's new DR format is going to be different from the current one. We have an archive system in place for older Detailed Reviews, but I'm hesitant to write a new one right now, knowing that things will be changing somewhat.
I'm looking for feedback here. My obvious preference is to a) post some updated comments in this thread, and b) post the Detailed Review with the new website. But if there's an overwhelming demand for the Detailed Review now, I'll get working on that.
So, which can you "settle' for? ;) I'll be posting this in a few other First Look threads as well.
iZappa Senior Member Joined: 14 Sep 2006 Posts: 129 Location: Norway Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Isomac Millenium Grinder: Anfim Haus, Ascaso i-2,... Drip: French press will do Roaster: Gene Cafe
Posted Fri Feb 13, 2009, 3:57am Subject: Re: Ascaso Steel Duo Espresso Machine
iZappa Said:
Is this the two-group with one thermoblock? If so, do you use it in a home setting (+- 1 liter milk a day) or in a commercial setting (2 liter ++ milk a day)?
The reason I ask is that I have encountered similar problems with the thermoblock. That was in a commercial setting (very small cafe). My theory is that it should not be used for such big quantities of milk a day. The gaskets can't take it and the thermoblock itself gets heavy damages from such constant use.
I maybe wrong and hope others will chime in who have used these machines with heavy use of the thermoblock.
Quick update on my earlier problem. Ascaso has updated the gasket of the steam thermoblock to a thicker one. The problem seems to be solved. Regarding how much use the thermoblock can take I'm still unsure. Other users experience, beside home use, would be highly appreciated.
By the way Mark. Did you know that Ascaso also can provide a steam tip that does not have the froth aid. I have tested some prototypes which needed minor adjustments. The standard tip is of course very good, especially for inexperienced users, but is good to have a versatile machine that allows for a bit of experimentation.
Posted Fri Feb 13, 2009, 9:46am Subject: Re: Ascaso Steel Duo Espresso Machine
MarkPrince Said:
I'm looking for feedback here. My obvious preference is to a) post some updated comments in this thread, and b) post the Detailed Review with the new website. So, which can you "settle' for? Mark
Your preference sounds good to me. We can certainly read your updated comments in this thread on this machine and wait for the detailed review when you launch the new website.
cflorimo Senior Member Joined: 13 Feb 2009 Posts: 7 Location: Newhall, CA Expertise: I love coffee
Posted Fri Feb 13, 2009, 4:10pm Subject: Re: Ascaso Steel Duo Espresso Machine
MarkPrince Said:
I'm looking for feedback here. My obvious preference is to a) post some updated comments in this thread, and b) post the Detailed Review with the new website. But if there's an overwhelming demand for the Detailed Review now, I'll get working on that.
So, which can you "settle' for? ;) I'll be posting this in a few other First Look threads as well.
Well, speaking as someone who has been sitting home with the flu for nearly a week with nothing to do except wonder, "should I just go ahead and order that Ascaso Steel Duo?" I'd love for you to drop some tidbits into this thread to ease my suffering one way or the other.. Then again, I'm looking forward to hearing more about the Baratza Vario, too ;)
None of this was a problem until my neighbor three doors down started his own roasting company and started dropping off samples for me to try. lead me unto tempatation...
MarkPrince Moderator Joined: 19 Dec 2001 Posts: 5,462 Location: Vancouver, BC Expertise: Professional
Espresso: KvdW Speedster Grinder: Compak K10 WBC Vac Pot: A bit too many Drip: Clive Coffee Drip Stand Roaster: Hario Glass Retro Roaster
Posted Fri Feb 13, 2009, 5:32pm Subject: Re: Ascaso Steel Duo Espresso Machine
Okay, here's some random testing notes before I head out the door for some errands.
Startup The Ascaso Steel Duo (non Professional model, so the one with a boiler / thermoblock combo) only takes a few minutes to get up to temperature, but it's a false start. You have to run some water through it if you want it actually heated up quick. Reasons I'm still trying to figure out, but I believe its because there's not enough water left in the boiler for a proper full heat up. Still looking into that.
To "cheat" the Ascaso up to full operating temperatures (water is 100C, PF is fully heated), you have to do the Silvia trick, and just run a lot of water through the group once you see the blue status light off. I'll have a more detailed look at this in the DR, but suffice to say, this only requires a couple of minutes once the boiler light goes off initially.
Temperature Surfing First, the temp gauge on the front of the machine may seem useless - when the boiler peaks, it 130C on mine (WHAT?) but actual measurements of that water coming out of the grouphead, using a fluke and modified 57mm blind filter setup I have (a poor man's Scace) show the exit water to be about 102C-103C at peak, and only for a very short time. I've measured it going as low as 88Cat the low end of the thermostat's deadband before the boiler heating element reactivates. It depends though - when not running water, and just waiting for the low end to kick in, then measuring the temperatures, its around 92C. So I'd call the deadband on this 102C-92C. A bit long, but workable.
I do the top down temp surfing vs. the bottom up temp surfing (top down means you get the boiler's heating element to cycle, and once the boiler light goes off, flush the group a bit to lower the temperatures, and pull your shot. Bottom up means you wait for the boiler light to go on, give it a few seconds, and while the light is still on, insert PF and brew shot).
I find with most Intelly coffees, giving a flush to the group until I stop seeing / hearing the steam flash (which brings me below 100C), then immediately pulling the shot has great results. It's about timing and experimenting. While you brew the shot, the brewing temperature is continually declining, and usually after a 25 second shot, I'll see the boiler light come on within 5-10 seconds after I'm done my shot. That tells me that I've probably gone from say, 98C initial down to about 94-93C or lower for the finish. This is generally a good thing for espresso brewing. In a way, it's a poor man's temperature profiling - as the shot progresses, you WANT lower water temps so that excessive bitters don't come out.
The PF / Grouphead It's no Rancilio Silvia. But neither is it a Solis SL-70. It is what it is, and it's not bad. Good amount of chromed brass in the portafilter. 57mm rather flimsy but usable baskets. You cannot updose much, given that the grouphead's dispersion screen hangs fairly low into the basket. Max dose is 18.5-19g - any more and you can't tighten the PF. At 18.5, you're really compressing the bed of coffee with the dispersion screen.
The grouphead's design is a shaped dispersion screen which I assume was designed to be used with pods as well as ground coffee. Dispersion pattern is okay, but not a full puck saturation, at least initially - this is why updosing doesn't work well on this machine (on top of not being able physically to do it much). You definitely want a bit of clearance between the dispersion screen and grouphead, so I've found that 16-16.5g is a nice sweet spot for the doses.
DaveZ Senior Member Joined: 5 Jan 2009 Posts: 12 Location: Phoenix AZ Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Trying to decide Grinder: Baratza Vario Vac Pot: Yama Drip: Bunn, Keurig Roaster: popcorn popper
Posted Thu Feb 19, 2009, 12:32pm Subject: Re: Ascaso Steel Duo Espresso Machine
MarkPrince Said:
Okay, here's some random testing notes before I head out the door for some errands.
Startup The Ascaso Steel Duo (non Professional model, so the one with a boiler / thermoblock combo) only takes a few minutes to get up to temperature, but it's a false start.
You List this as the Steel Duo (non Professional model...) How is this different from the item offered at 1st-line? click here Seems like they both have the boiler/thermblock set up but the "current" one seems to have changed the placement of the switches and guage. Are there other differences you can notice in features mentioned?
Symbols: = New Posts since your last visit = No New Posts since last visit = Newest post
Forum Rules: No profanity, illegal acts or personal attacks will be tolerated in these discussion boards. No commercial posting of any nature will be tolerated; only private sales by private individuals, in the "Buy and Sell" forum. No cross posting allowed - do not post your topic to more than one forum, nor repost a topic to the same forum. Who Can Read The Forum? Anyone can read posts in these discussion boards. Who Can Post New Topics? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post new topics. Who Can Post Replies? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post replies. Can Photos be posted? Anyone can post photos in their new topics or replies. Who can change or delete posts? Any CoffeeGeek member can edit their own posts. Only moderators can delete posts. Probationary Period: If you are a new signup for CoffeeGeek, you cannot promote, endorse, criticise or otherwise post an unsolicited endorsement for any company, product or service in your first five postings.
= No New Posts since last visit 