AdamD Senior Member Joined: 15 Mar 2005 Posts: 68 Location: MA
Posted Sun Aug 14, 2005, 5:56pm Subject: It's not about the buzz ...
Y'all listen to the coffeegeek podcasts? They're excellent! I listen to them all, and look forward to the next one.
I've grown quite curious though about Mark's comments about caffeine. He's not into it. I'm clear on Mark Prince's opinion about it as he explained it at length in one of the podcasts, saying how the thing that makes coffee so awesome is its quality of flavor, the rituals that accompany coffee preparation and consumption and such things. He has expressed annoyance that he can't continuously drink coffee because of the caffeine. He has even taken to introducing the last couple podcasts with a line something like "welcome to the CG podacst where it's not about the buzz -- it's about the quality"
Now each to his own, I guess. But my own definitely aligns with the buzz ... and to a pretty good degree. I love the caffeine in coffee. It's the caffeine that brightens conversations, and caffeine helps me through long work shifts, and it lends a hand in creative endeavors (painting or writing). And would there even be coffee rituals if there were no caffeine?
So Mark's been pretty clear about his perspective, else I'd address this whole message to him, to ask him to discuss it on the podcast. But instead I guess I just wanted to know how other people responded to the idea. Is caffeine actually a downside to the coffee for other coffeegeeks? Or is Mark Prince something of a curiosity among coffee drinkers?
Posted Sun Aug 14, 2005, 6:39pm Subject: Re: It's not about the buzz ...
Well, I love coffee but I could take or leave the buzz. In fact, I switch to decaf after my third or fourth double because too much caffeine can bring my Meniere's Syndrome out of remission. I had such a hellish autumn and winter last year (horribly distorted hearing, all acoustic instruments sounded out of tune--awful for a folk musician) until it resolved in March that I don't ever want to revisit it if I can at all help it. I take as much care with decaf as with regular beans, and though I prefer regular it's only because the taste and crema are more dependable with regular. When the decaf is fresh and the grind is right, it is quite luscious. Only reason I even have regular any more is to wake up, keep my lungs open and hold the headache at bay. I wish caffeine could do all that without creating a buzz (I don't like an alcohol buzz either).
Sandy www.sandyandina.com ------------------- Life's too short to drink lousy coffee, play crummy guitars and write with ballpoint pens.
mattyj Senior Member Joined: 5 Apr 2004 Posts: 1,092 Location: Sydney Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Expobar Office Pulser Grinder: Mazzer Mini Vac Pot: Hario Mocha 3 Cup ... broken...
Posted Sun Aug 14, 2005, 6:41pm Subject: Re: It's not about the buzz ...
hmm ... it used to be about the buzz for me. A friend used to work in a computer shop/internet cafe thing, and he made coffee's on their espresso machine ... they had one on the menu called the 'heartstarter', which in hindsight was just a double cap. I used to love them, thinking I was a real hardcore coffeedrinker for being 'able to handle them'.
During college/study, I used to go through about 4-5 mugs of drip coffee in a couple of hours. I usually got to the end of the day feeling bloated and ill, still feeling very tired and drowsy, but unable to sleep. I started drinking less coffee, and more water. Coffee didn't perk me up, it only kept me awake.
But since then, the taste had always frustrated me - most coffee I drank (the FP stuff I made at home as well as many cafe's I visited) was bitter, and not very nice.
Then I found two great cafe's and got my first espresso machine. The coffee from these places tasted (and still taste) awesome. I wanted to make it at home, I wanted to drink it all day - not for the buzz, but for the taste. Since then, it's been an endless pursuit for getting the nicest tasting coffee I can. I love the taste, with and without milk, and the fact having it late at night keeps me up til morning is a frustration.
So for me, it's not about the buzz. If I want buzz, I drink energy drinks.
AdamD Senior Member Joined: 15 Mar 2005 Posts: 68 Location: MA
Posted Sun Aug 14, 2005, 8:31pm Subject: Re: It's not about the buzz ...
Thanks for the response guys. And I guess I'd like to clarify my perspective a little bit more too.
I don't mean to say I'm all about the caffeine. I definitely have a caffeine addiction and suffer a good headache if I don't have my coffee. But I don't drink coffee just to satisfy a need, or just to get a buzz. If I'm on a road trip, and can't find a real cafe, I'd rather suffer the headache than drink gas station coffee. But God put caffeine in those beans for me to love. I insist on having a good cup that was ethically sourced and craft-roasted, drank in good company etc ... I want quality and I hate the idea that people treat coffee as just a commodity, or a fix. That's just not to say a mature love of coffee excludes an appreciation for what it does as a stimulant. Caffeine is a good thing when it's not abused.
But maybe more coffee geeks just don't like caffeine? I'm curious to hear more people's perspectives.
Yann Senior Member Joined: 1 Dec 2002 Posts: 227 Location: Wellington (New Zealand) Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: La Marzocco GS/3 Grinder: Mazzer Kony-E
Posted Sun Aug 14, 2005, 10:56pm Subject: Re: It's not about the buzz ...
I don't think it's ever been about the buzz for me. I never really drank coffee at all until uni. And even then, it was not for late night cramming or to help me study, but simply as a social beverage at a cafe with friends. I think I've had about a 2 cups of instant coffee in my life. They weren't particularly great (suprise), and when I started to drink coffee, I usually got things such as mochas, or added sugar to whatever else I got. Now, a while later, I don't add sugar to anything, and tend to have coffee either as an espresso, machiatto, or shorter kind of milk drink.
I've never really used it as a stimulant. My coffee routine during the day only really starts after I get home from work (6pm-ish). I only have one to two (sometimes three) cups, from then until around midnight. I can quite happily go to sleep straight I've had a couple of doubles. Granted that after a few shots, I can feel the effect of the caffiene.
What probably draws me most to coffee, are the rituals of coffee preparation and consumption. I love making shots, and trying to get things right. On that never ending quest to make a better shot, and to get my latte art consistent. Also to me, drinking coffee has always been something social. Outings with good friends is something which made me begin my consuption of coffee.
To me, I do get a bit annoyed that I can't continually consume coffee. But I think it's in the sense that I would like to have the opportunity to keep on making coffee to fine tune my technique. Though in reality, it's a bit of a waste (given the expense of beans and milk), and that I can't really drink it all given the volume etc.
Anyhow, I'm home now, so I'm going to make some coffee :)
dankbean Senior Member Joined: 8 Jun 2005 Posts: 886 Location: Raleigh, NC Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: mine Roaster: self
Posted Mon Aug 15, 2005, 6:54am Subject: Re: It's not about the buzz ...
hmmm....
sad to say, i really don't get a buzz from coffee anymore. i drink drip in moderation, along with alcohol and cigarettes. everything in moderation.
when i first started drinking coffee, it was definitely for the caffeine. since i was getting most of it from Sheetz, it definitely wasn't for the spectacular taste! i was a college student with a kegermeister in the living room, so the wake-up effect of coffee was a necessity for me.
then i started going to the local coffee shops, and my coffee drinking turned into an exploration rather than a pitstop on the way to microbiology class. the idea of fruity notes in my coffee was laughable until i actually tried it, and i was impressed to say the least.
i suppose the wake-up effect is still there, because i am useless in the morning without a mug in my hand. on the weekends, i refrain from making coffee in the morning, and i have a hangover face even when there was no drinking involved the night before. this Monday morning, it's around 11am, and i'm on my third cup of Brazil. nowadays, i look for a coffee that i can slowly enjoy to the point that it's cold in my cup, and still has an inviting taste. there's definitely no "buzz", just a nice warm feeling in ze belly. by lunchtime, i've usually switched to smoothies and frappes, mostly out of habit.
bottom line: as long as it tastes good "til the last drop" :), i'll drink it, caffeine or not. the caffeine isn't a prerequisite, nor is it a hindrance to me drinking a full airpot by myself. :)
c4h5n2o Senior Member Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 39 Location: Vancouver Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: LaCimbali Jr.; LaMarzocco... Grinder: Mazzer Mini Drip: Kitchen aid ultra compact Roaster: Buzzroaster
Posted Mon Aug 15, 2005, 10:57pm Subject: Re: It's not about the buzz ...
I'd be drinking nothing but decaf in a heartbeat if the flavour was as consistent as a regular bean. I keep experimenting with decaf beans. Caffeine adds nothing desireable & it's unfortunate that de-caffenation usually affects the taste. Never got or wanted a buzz from coffee. If I'm enjoying more than three or four shots in a day, the jittery /diuretic effect is 100% negative. Just waiting for a decent hybrid berry that has very low caffeine to start with..
Posted Tue Aug 16, 2005, 12:47am Subject: Re: It's not about the buzz ...
AdamD Said:
If I'm on a road trip, and can't find a real cafe, I'd rather suffer the headache than drink gas station coffee. But God put caffeine in those beans for me to love. I insist on having a good cup that was ethically sourced and craft-roasted, drank in good company etc ... I want quality and I hate the idea that people treat coffee as just a commodity, or a fix. That's just not to say a mature love of coffee excludes an appreciation for what it does as a stimulant. Caffeine is a good thing when it's not abused.
But maybe more coffee geeks just don't like caffeine? I'm curious to hear more people's perspectives.
That is why I travel with fresh-roasted beans, a grinder, and the means to brew them. If the headache should kick in (which it hasn't ever since I started doing that) I could just chew a couple of beans. But it's not about the buzz for me: it's about the aroma, the ritual, the comfort of the steaming cup, and the flavor; and the best decaf can give me pretty much all of that, though the real thing does taste and smell better. After my first morning cup I'm nicely alert and can drink decaf the rest of the day; and when I developed Meniere's last fall that's just what I did (tapering off slowly per my neurotologist's advice). There are days when I don't switch to decaf till nightfall, but there are still also days when that first cup or shot of regular is all I want and afterward, a decaf espresso or cappa hits the spot as nicely (and in a breve, I actually think the nutty taste of the steamed cream is enhanced more by decaf than regular).
Sandy www.sandyandina.com ------------------- Life's too short to drink lousy coffee, play crummy guitars and write with ballpoint pens.
Jasonian Senior Member Joined: 8 Aug 2005 Posts: 3,846 Location: Lubbock, TX Expertise: Professional
Posted Wed Aug 17, 2005, 12:39pm Subject: Re: It's not about the buzz ...
I'm inclined to think that it SHOULD be more about the quality of the product itself, and less about the drug it contains.
I see a commonality with this and pipes (I am an occasional pipe-smoker as well).
The argument is whether the pipe is more of a ritual and art to enjoying good tobacco or whether it is merely another "nicotine delivery device". If it is merely a nicotene delivery device, there are most certainly more efficient ways to getting your fix.. so it should definitely NOT be about the drug.. but about the experience/art/quality above anything else.
the same is true with coffee. With products like Red Bull, No Doze, even Mountain Dew or other caffeinated soft drinks, the ritual of brewing quality coffee or espresso seems like a waste of efforts if the focus is the drug contained in it. The reason we all like coffee is most definitely not the buzz.. but the pleasure we receive from the artistry and flavor of a truly great cup'o'joe. Sure.. the caffeine may be an upside to some and a downside to others, but if you frequent this forum I am willing to bet money that it's not the main focus... there is simply much more to it than that.
jakethecoffeelover Senior Member Joined: 3 Mar 2005 Posts: 1,036 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada Expertise: Pro Barista
Espresso: Gaggia Espresso Grinder: Mazzer Super Jolly... Vac Pot: Perhaps in the future... Drip: Insulated Bodum Kenya FP Roaster: Hearthware iRoast
Posted Wed Aug 17, 2005, 7:52pm Subject: Re: It's not about the buzz ...
You don't know how much I wish I could try alcoholic beverages and cigars without worrying about illegal substances (I'm only 15). The day when I can drink 15 different varieties of beer and still be able to think clearly or drive home, I'll be in heaven. I've had a more than a taste of either and some taste absolutely amazing and the ritual is great. Scotch is a good example for me, too.
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