The popper produces sour coffee--it's still a step up from store-bought, but the drum produces rich, mellow and surprisingly sweet coffee. I've roasted two batches of CCM's Mexican Turqesa in the popper and been less than happy with either, but yesterday I roasted up some in the drum and this morning made some in my moka pot. It was extremely good.
The drum takes about 15-17 minutes to get to second crack. The popper takes about 9-11. Is that the main difference? If I increased airflow, or used a dimmer switch, would that get me close to the same quality as the drum?
I'd love to get this kind of quality out of the popper--I actually prefer to use the popper--it's so much safer, cheaper and easier, but the results from the drum are flippin' incredible by comparison.
Posted Fri Jun 3, 2005, 8:46am Subject: Re: Closing the gap between air popper and drum roaster
I've been very happy with the results I've gotten from my modified Poppery; I haven't once had a problem with sourness. I'd be curious to know if anyone else notices a significant difference between drum roasting and popper roasting.
Aaron- how long are you letting the beans sit before using? Some beans can take significantly longer to degass than others, and can taste sour if used too soon. Are you using the beans for espresso or for brewed coffee? What type of beans are you using? Big, big differences in all of the above variables.
"If it wasn't for coffee, I'd have no discernible personality at all."
Posted Fri Jun 3, 2005, 8:47am Subject: Re: Closing the gap between air popper and drum roaster
What modifications have you done to your popper? An unmodified popper will produce the "sourness" you are getting. I've also discovered certain beans will have to be taken darker than you're used to on a faster roast. The drum has a longer time to burn out the sourness but also evapoates alot of the complexities that are fragile in beans-in my opinion. So the trick is to try and achieve both. Joe
Posted Fri Jun 3, 2005, 8:54am Subject: Re: Closing the gap between air popper and drum roaster
zephyrus Said:
I've been very happy with the results I've gotten from my modified Poppery; I haven't once had a problem with sourness. I'd be curious to know if anyone else notices a significant difference between drum roasting and popper roasting. .
I have noticed alot of differences, I actually get a sour taste from drum roasted coffee as it develops. It isn't the unroasted sour that you sometimes get from a stopped too early roast, common for poppers. My air roasted coffee seems to keep longer than Drum roasted but when you drink it within a week who cares? It is very difficult to reproduce roasts unless you have a defined pattern in your roasting with poppers and alike. Things like outside temp,etc... can really mess that up also. These are the things we go through, unless you are willing to pid your popper. Then you can have complete control over your roast. I do have to say I got a chance to use a probat sample roaster recently....It was pretty cool. I didn't realize that there wasn't open flames under the drum. It's these tubes that get hot like lanterns, really cool!!! Joe
jamuka Senior Member Joined: 24 Apr 2005 Posts: 67 Location: Orlando FL Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Rancilio Silvia Grinder: Kitchenaid Proline, Retro, &... Vac Pot: In search of... Drip: never again Roaster: 3 Poppery Mark I's
Posted Fri Jun 3, 2005, 9:38am Subject: Re: Closing the gap between air popper and drum roaster
I've loosened the silver screw (sounds pretty euphamistic) and replaced the sheild with a soup can and a lint screen (for collecting chaff)
I've done the power switch mod and sometimes I turn the heater off and on to try to slow the roast.
It gets pretty hot.
I like using the poppery because the cracks are so easy to hear and the beans are visible. The drum isn't nearly as much fun, but it's yielding better coffee.
Before my wife was pregnant, we also enjoyed the aroma of the popper filling the house. Now it makes her want to puke. Me brewing coffee makes her want to puke... grinding makes her want to puke. Talking about coffee makes her want to puke...
I guess this is the wrong thread for that problem...
Posted Fri Jun 3, 2005, 9:47am Subject: Re: Closing the gap between air popper and drum roaster
jamuka Said:
I've loosened the silver screw (sounds pretty euphamistic) and replaced the sheild with a soup can and a lint screen (for collecting chaff)
I've done the power switch mod and sometimes I turn the heater off and on to try to slow the roast.
It gets pretty hot.
I like using the poppery because the cracks are so easy to hear and the beans are visible. The drum isn't nearly as much fun, but it's yielding better coffee.
Before my wife was pregnant, we also enjoyed the aroma of the popper filling the house. Now it makes her want to puke. Me brewing coffee makes her want to puke... grinding makes her want to puke. Talking about coffee makes her want to puke...
I guess this is the wrong thread for that problem...
I have kept my SC/CO and BBQ drum around, but the truth is that I really like the modified popper for my drip stuff. I wouldn't call it sour, but bright. I agree that for espresso a longer roast is probably better, and the SC/CO or some sort of drum roast works well for that. The reality is that Joe lets me use his SonoFresco, so the majority of my coffee is roasted in that, and I use the popper to fill in.
Posted Fri Jun 3, 2005, 10:27am Subject: Re: Closing the gap between air popper and drum roaster
I would suggest adding a heat switch/thermometer to your mods. You will have tons of control over your roast. Especially with your popper. If your unsuccesful and want to sell me yours let me know, I have always wanted an original poppery. Joe
RapidCoffee Senior Member Joined: 4 Dec 2004 Posts: 1,862 Location: Rapid City, SD Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: La Spaziale S1 Grinder: Mazzer Robur, Mazzer Major,... Vac Pot: Yama, also French press Drip: misc. filters, AeroPress Roaster: AeroRost, FreshRoast, SC/CO,...
Posted Fri Jun 3, 2005, 11:14am Subject: Re: Closing the gap between air popper and drum roaster
It is possible you are mistaking acidity for sourness. In general, the shorter fluid bed roasts from an air popper will yield a brighter, more acidic cup. Acidity, however, is not the same as sourness. Many coffee drinkers prefer the livelier cup that results. Others like the mellower body that a longer roast produces. De gustibus non est disputandem.
jim_schulman Senior Member Joined: 19 Dec 2001 Posts: 3,772 Location: Chicago Expertise: I live coffee
Posted Fri Jun 3, 2005, 4:47pm Subject: Re: Closing the gap between air popper and drum roaster
After endless profiling experiments, I' m fairly sure the main difference between the two, and it's to the advantage of the drums, is that poppers raise the beans from room temperature to above 300F in about 1 minute, whereas it takes 4 to 7 minutes in a drum. After that, drums roast at the same pace, or maybe even a hair faster. I'm hypothesizing that the fast heat up in poppers means the beans are carrying too much moisture into the roasting temperature region (350+), and this leads to the preservation of chlorigenic acids along with their grassy sour-bitter, sweetness and aroma killing taste. As added evidence, very dry beans, like Yemens and DP Ethiopians, roast wonderfully on poppers, even though they can be very acidic.
Based on this, a popper could be modified very cheaply by somebody competent (not me, alas) to produce a high quality roast. The effect of the mod is to create a "low heat switch." The cost would be a 20 amp switch and some heater wire. Add heater wire in series with the existing heater wire to reduce the wattage to about 66% of the original. This will reduce the airflow out of the popper heater to about 350F. The switch would go into the circuit in parallel to the extra wire, so when it is closed, it shorts out the extra winding, and pushes the wattage and heat back up to normal. A variac on the heat alone is an easier but more expensive solution.
Operation is simple: run the popper at 350F (temperature of air as it first gets to the beans) until the beans get to 300F, or turn yellow; then hit the switch for normal power until the roast is done. I think this simple mod would get most of the benefit of a PID system. After all my experiments, here's how i run my PIDed roaster -- I blow in 350 air for 4 to 5 minutes, raise it to 500F in the next four minutes, then level out there. How different is that from the simple switch? It probably would take most poppers as long to ramp from 350 to 500 even without the PID.
Symbols: = New Posts since your last visit = No New Posts since last visit = Newest post
Forum Rules: No profanity, illegal acts or personal attacks will be tolerated in these discussion boards. No commercial posting of any nature will be tolerated; only private sales by private individuals, in the "Buy and Sell" forum. No cross posting allowed - do not post your topic to more than one forum, nor repost a topic to the same forum. Who Can Read The Forum? Anyone can read posts in these discussion boards. Who Can Post New Topics? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post new topics. Who Can Post Replies? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post replies. Can Photos be posted? Anyone can post photos in their new topics or replies. Who can change or delete posts? Any CoffeeGeek member can edit their own posts. Only moderators can delete posts. Probationary Period: If you are a new signup for CoffeeGeek, you cannot promote, endorse, criticise or otherwise post an unsolicited endorsement for any company, product or service in your first five postings.
= No New Posts since last visit 