Chris_S Senior Member Joined: 26 Dec 2007 Posts: 88 Location: South Dakota Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: rancilio silvia, moka,... Grinder: rocky Vac Pot: no Drip: aeropress and press pot Roaster: hottop & poppery II
Posted Wed Dec 14, 2011, 3:39pm Subject: Re: Data Logging
I really think the arduino is an amazing piece of hardware that a person can learn and play with. From the little bit I have read it sounds like it is more of a beginners piece of equipment but has a lot of possibilities. Since I'm inexperienced with this type of electronics is there something that someone would recommend to learn about the arduino. Would I just get a beginners kit and start there? I think the arduino would be a great learning experience.
I plan on reading through the thread on homeroasters.org and also downloading the software and taking a look at it. I will post more questions if something comes up.
Adafruit.com is a good place for things Arduino. They have a starter pack (out of stock at the moment), as well as a budget starter kit. I think either of these would be more than enough to get you started down the rabbit hole :-)
The Freeduino is a nice, inexpensive Arduino clone. It comes in kit form, but is pretty simple to build. I bought a Freeduino recently to use for testing and initializing TC4 shields and was pleased with it.
Chris_S Senior Member Joined: 26 Dec 2007 Posts: 88 Location: South Dakota Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: rancilio silvia, moka,... Grinder: rocky Vac Pot: no Drip: aeropress and press pot Roaster: hottop & poppery II
Posted Wed Dec 14, 2011, 9:35pm Subject: Re: Data Logging
Thanks so much for your help Jim. Your posts with the links have helped tremendously. Its been so nice to come back to this thread and reference links. I've been looking through Artisan and this looks like its exactly what I'm looking for.
I've been looking for something like this periodically the last few years. Since Christmas was here and I was trying to think of ideas for myself is why I started doing some searching again. I haven't really had any place to roast and have been out of the works for awhile. This equipment and software looks really exciting and I need to find a good place to roast that won't get me in trouble with the smoke. I think I roast it a little to dark. I usually go right into second crack then dump, and that's when the smoke starts rolling. That stuff sure leaves a smelly odor for awhile...even with hood exhaust vents.
farmroast Senior Member Joined: 13 Jul 2006 Posts: 1,417 Location: Amherst MA. Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: Oly:Cremina,Maxi. MCAL... Grinder: Majors, Dienes Vac Pot: Hellem10 Drip: CCD, and more Roaster: 1kg. DreamRoast
Posted Wed Dec 14, 2011, 10:33pm Subject: Re: Data Logging
Here's a screen capture of my TC4. An earlier custom blended version for my setup. The "juice" reading is volts from my variac to the heating element. But I mostly roast by watching the LCD display readings. Having BT RoR readings transforms how you can relate with the progression of the roast.
Chris_S Senior Member Joined: 26 Dec 2007 Posts: 88 Location: South Dakota Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: rancilio silvia, moka,... Grinder: rocky Vac Pot: no Drip: aeropress and press pot Roaster: hottop & poppery II
Posted Fri Jan 13, 2012, 7:49am Subject: Re: Data Logging
Jim I just ordered the TC4 board and was wondering what kind of thermal probes I can attach to the board for readings. I want something that will sustain the heat and last. I bought something at a cooking store once and I ruined it after few roasts. I don't think it was ment for sustained heat, and more for quick readings. Do you have a recommendation? I'm using the Hottop roaster and would like to somehow mount the probes in the back of the machine.
I started down the homeroasters forum but only made it so far. There is a lot of info and half of it is greek to me. =/ I also bought the arduino starter pack and started learning with it. I think its going to be a lot of fun. I was wondering if there is already some code to use on the TC4 site that you could point me to for the arduino once I get the TC4 shield.
JGG Senior Member Joined: 31 Mar 2006 Posts: 1,343 Location: Kentucky, US Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: PID Silvia; PID Alexia Grinder: Mazzer Mini E (A), SJ; Rocky... Roaster: Hottop D w/PID; Thermometric...
Posted Fri Jan 13, 2012, 9:25am Subject: Re: Data Logging
Hi, Chris -
Just boxed up your TC4 kit (I hope the PayPal address is right -- your CG profile is different).
The TC4 software includes support for type K, type T, and type J thermocouples. All of the TC4 roasting applications are set up by default for type K, which is a very good all around choice. If you buy a probe that will be exposed to roasting heat, make sure the lead wire insulation is up to the task. Fiberglass is a good choice as long as you don't expose it to abrasion. I think Kapton is probably OK, too, but I normally use fiberglass.
For back wall mounting in a Hottop, I would use a bare bead probe for the environmental sensor. I mounted mine through a short 1/8" SS tube and used JB Weld to fasten it all in place. The tip of the probe sticks out an inch or so from the tube so that the air temperature can be measured with minimal effects from the metal in the rear wall. Maybe something like the Omega 5TC-GG-K-24-36 (package of 5):
I think you could do something similar for the bean probe (i.e. 1/8" tube + JB Weld). But you would not want to let the tip protrude out far enough so that the insulation comes in contact with the beans. Maybe just poke the tip out 1/8" or so and then JB Weld it in place.
The other option is to use a pre-made sheathed probe, ideally with an exposed tip. This is neater, but may be more expensive?
The best TC4 application to begin with is Bourbon. You can download the latest released version here: Click Here (code.google.com)
Alternatively, Artisan is a very complete roasting program, and is fully compatible with the TC4: Click Here (code.google.com)
Chris_S Senior Member Joined: 26 Dec 2007 Posts: 88 Location: South Dakota Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: rancilio silvia, moka,... Grinder: rocky Vac Pot: no Drip: aeropress and press pot Roaster: hottop & poppery II
Posted Fri Jan 13, 2012, 10:53am Subject: Re: Data Logging
Thanks Jim. The address I submitted for the order is correct, should be South Dakota. I need to update CG.
I will have to look into the Thermocouplers and the types of insulation. I thought I had seen the sheath type that you talked about using stainless steel. I just don't know the costs of them. I also seen ceramic and wondered about them.
Another thing I wondered about is if anyone has ever ran into getting a buildup of, I guess you could say, burnt oil on the end of your probe tips? Would it alter the readings, and have to be cleaned periodically. Is your JB welding method making the probe permanent?
JGG Senior Member Joined: 31 Mar 2006 Posts: 1,343 Location: Kentucky, US Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: PID Silvia; PID Alexia Grinder: Mazzer Mini E (A), SJ; Rocky... Roaster: Hottop D w/PID; Thermometric...
Posted Fri Jan 13, 2012, 1:23pm Subject: Re: Data Logging
Stainless is fine, and normally the least expensive sheath material.
The constant movement of the beans keeps the tip clean on the bean probe. I haven't noticed any significant build up on the environmental sensor (I am very careful not to look).
The JB Weld epoxy is pretty permanent. But I'd say you could probably remove it with some work.
Chris_S Senior Member Joined: 26 Dec 2007 Posts: 88 Location: South Dakota Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: rancilio silvia, moka,... Grinder: rocky Vac Pot: no Drip: aeropress and press pot Roaster: hottop & poppery II
Posted Mon Jan 16, 2012, 9:52am Subject: Re: Data Logging
Is there a preferred gauge of wire used for the thermocoupler? It looks like 30GA is popular, and 20GA is similar in price. I'm unaware of the pros and cons between the different gauges when it comes to temperature sensing.
JGG Senior Member Joined: 31 Mar 2006 Posts: 1,343 Location: Kentucky, US Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: PID Silvia; PID Alexia Grinder: Mazzer Mini E (A), SJ; Rocky... Roaster: Hottop D w/PID; Thermometric...
Posted Tue Jan 17, 2012, 6:38am Subject: Re: Data Logging
It depends on the environment and location of the sensor.
Small gauge wires respond much more quickly. They are good for things like measuring gas temperatures and quickly changing fluid temperatures. But they are pretty fragile. Too fragile, IMO, for using in a roaster.
Heavy gauge wires are a lot tougher and can stand more physical abuse. They also have a lower resistance which is important for really long distances between measurement point and instrument. But they don't respond as quickly.
I think 30 ga is probably too fine to stand up to the abuse. I think 20 ga might be right on the edge of being too thick, but still in the ballpark.
FWIW, I have used 24 ga for all of the sensors in my Hottop and Poppery I roasters. This heavy enough to be durable and light enough to respond. It is pretty easy to work with at connections, too.
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