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faster
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Joined: 27 May 2013
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Location: France
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: ISOMAC TEA II
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Posted Fri Aug 23, 2013, 6:33am
Subject: Roasting TIME question help.
 

Hi all,
I have been roasting with a stovetop popcorn popper for a while and just got this one in the picture. (Size of drum: 4" x 7" = 10cm x 19cm)
I have a question on drum roasters in general,  what is the best heat source for them?

TIA

faster: Drum roast 1_Small.JPG
(Click for larger image)
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Burner0000
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Posted Sun Aug 25, 2013, 7:48am
Subject: Re: DRUM Roaster: what heat source should I use?
 

I would go with gas.  It's more efficient, easy cost less. You could rip apart a $25 BBQ and put the burner under that. That would do 1 lb easy or install 2 for $50 and you got yourself a 1 kg roaster.
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faster
Senior Member


Joined: 27 May 2013
Posts: 90
Location: France
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: ISOMAC TEA II
Grinder: Rossi RR45
Roaster: PIDed, Modified "My...
Posted Mon Aug 26, 2013, 3:21am
Subject: Roasting TIME question help.
 

I use 2 manual roasters: Popcorn Popper, stovetop and a horizontal perforated drum roaster, both used with gas.

Question I have: Is Time Critical? What is acceptable min/max time to FC, in a home over gas roaster type environment?

With the popcorn popper, I get FC in about 9 minutes and SC in 13 min; (low flame because of size of burner)

With the drum roster, I have full flame, and FC comes around 15 minutes and SC about 18 minutes but there seems to be a smoother transition between FC and SC, the roast is very even.  (roasting is quiet, because I don't hear the wire whisks of popcorn popper scratching the bottom).

Both roasts done with 8oz/200g batch

What I would like to know: is the TIME of 15 minutes to FC OK? Is it not too long and I start to "BAKE" them?
The beans look beautiful, smooth, slightly shiny done to Full City+...

Thanks in advance
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Netphilosopher
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Posted Mon Aug 26, 2013, 5:26am
Subject: .
 

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faster
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Joined: 27 May 2013
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Location: France
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Espresso: ISOMAC TEA II
Grinder: Rossi RR45
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Posted Mon Aug 26, 2013, 6:54am
Subject: Re: Roasting TIME question help.
 

Netphilosopher Said:

The answer is, of course, completely dependent on how it tastes.  

Personally, I find if I achieve 1st crack before 13 minutes, I'll be fine, but I do generally target 1st crack starting by around 8:00.  Middle ground is between 13-16 minutes, and I expect (but am sometimes surprised) flatter profile ("baked") if I don't get 1st crack by 16 minutes.  Those tend to be really long 1st crack, with 2nd crack mixing in with the end of 1st crack finish... and ending up 18-20 minutes for the full roast.

1st crack generally lasts a couple to three minutes, the space between 1st and 2nd crack can be 0 to 1 minute - but it all depends on your heating profile and your roaster's capacity.  "Baked" isn't ideal, but it certainly isn't undrinkable.  Compared to Maxwell House, if your source bean is good, you'll still be miles ahead... :D

Posted August 26, 2013 link

Reading your reply, 15-16 minutes is the limit...I do 8-9min. times with Popcorn popper, but after only 2 roasts in drum roaster I still didn't manage to get it down to ~9 minutes, I will experiment with a smaller batch~6 ozs./150g and higher flame...

Aren't "baked" beans (amongst us geeks) considered ruined, even though they beat Maxwell?

Thanks Netphilosopher
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Burner0000
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Posted Mon Aug 26, 2013, 8:32am
Subject: Re: Roasting TIME question help.
 

Id say 18min for FC is the limit.  20min regardless of roast temp you are baking the beans.  Time between cracks usually isn't much.  I would try a smaller load or larger heater.   Maybe move the flames closer to the drum.  I would try medium heat until you see browning, full heat until you begin to hear 1C and bring the heat back to medium and coast into FC.
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Netphilosopher
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Posted Mon Aug 26, 2013, 9:58am
Subject: .
 

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JKalpin
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JKalpin
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Posted Mon Aug 26, 2013, 2:29pm
Subject: Re: Roasting TIME question help.
 

My experience is that hot-air fluidized roasting seems to be fast and radiant-heat drum roasting seems to be slow.

With my FR+8, (hot-air) roasting 4 oz at a time, roasting times were around 5 minutes.  With temperature data-logging and a dimmer I could move it up to 8 minutes.  

With my Behmor, (radiant drum) roasting 10 oz at a time, roasting times are around 18 minutes on P1 (hottest profile).

That is not a fair comparison, 4 oz vs 10 oz, but in some ways it is because the coffee tastes good either way.  

The purists might argue that there is an 'optimum' roast time when you want to reveal the various fruit flavours and aromas that are available in some beans.  They obviously have a better palate than I, because I have never, even by accident, been able to reveal them.  If I had, I'm not sure I would 'like' them;  I brew coffee because I like the taste of coffee a lot and don't want a beverage that tastes like Gator-Aide or apple-juice.  

With either system of roasting I take the beans right to the start of the 2CR, where they are dark brown with just a light sheen of oil, and that's where the coffee taste has the best intensity, not too bright, not too bitter.

I am currently roasting Sumatra Mandheling and Sweet Maria's Monkey Blend, both approaching 19 min (10 oz) and to get that dark brown with a slight oil sheen I am almost 1 min. into the 2CR.  I find that confusing.  But I don't worry about roasting-time until I get beyond 20 min.

 
Jerry
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Netphilosopher
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Posted Tue Aug 27, 2013, 6:00am
Subject: .
 

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faster
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Joined: 27 May 2013
Posts: 90
Location: France
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: ISOMAC TEA II
Grinder: Rossi RR45
Roaster: PIDed, Modified "My...
Posted Tue Aug 27, 2013, 8:18am
Subject: Re: Roasting TIME question help.
 

Netphilosopher Said:

Geeks are different than snobs.  Really good foodies and sommeliers don't just taste excellent foods and wines all the time.  To know the darkness, you must experience the light, but also the twilight in between.  I see coffee as a spectrum, not a right/wrong answer.  I sample bad and good coffee, old and fresh coffee... keeps my experience base expanded.

Posted August 26, 2013 link

After reading your "philosophical ranting", my first thought was: WTF are you talking about?...

Most people with a developed taste don't need to do what you're doing. They have a "taste memory" and look for new tastes and foods to discover.

You on the other hand are different; you need to eat/drink shit to remind yourself that there is also good food/coffee...I wonder what "good food" to you may be?  KFC? lol....

I don't care that you call me a snob, coming from you, I take it as a compliment, just don't f#$%ing patronise me.
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