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Have you heard about the new roaster from Denmark?
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oldgearhead
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Posted Tue Mar 18, 2014, 9:06pm
Subject: Have you heard about the new roaster from Denmark?
 

It's the Aillio Bullet Roaster. It appears to have the heating element inside the drum and:
1) It has an insulated drum.
2) Roasts 1 Kg loads in 12-15 minutes.
3) Runs on only 1550 watts of either 120V or 220 V power.
4) Isn't available yet but they are getting close.
http://aillio.com/
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DavecUK
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Posted Wed Mar 19, 2014, 4:07am
Subject: Re: Have you heard about the new roaster from Denmark?
 

I should be getting a one to review before they launch....and yes I am looking forward to it, from the information I have been supplied by the company, it looks a very interesting roaster.
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NobbyR
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Posted Wed Mar 19, 2014, 4:43am
Subject: Re: Have you heard about the new roaster from Denmark?
 

oldgearhead Said:

Roasts 1 Kg loads in 12-15 minutes.

Posted March 18, 2014 link

Roasting speed is pointless. Industrial hot air roasting is very fast and involves high temperatures, but the results are less compelling, while traditional artisan drum roasting is more time consuming and requires a lot of experience, but is capable of exibiting the aromas we are looking for in gourmet coffee.

I'm not saying that you cannot do this with this particular roaster. It's just that this statement is no sign of quality. It would be more interesting to know if it can do roasting profiles, for example.

 
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"This drink of the Satan is so delicious that it would be a shame to leave it to the infidels." (Pope Clement VIII on coffee, when he was urged to ban the beverage)
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kboom1
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Posted Wed Mar 19, 2014, 6:33am
Subject: Re: Have you heard about the new roaster from Denmark?
 

I asked  Jonas the one marketing it on several forums What the roast times were doing a full 1k being it was only 1500w.

Here was his reply,

We have roasted 1kg Brazil, using just 1300w in 12 min.
As I remember it was 30-45sec into second crack.
Its definitely possible.
Jonas
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CMIN
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Posted Wed Mar 19, 2014, 7:09am
Subject: Re: Have you heard about the new roaster from Denmark?
 

That's sounds cool
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CoffeeRoastersClub
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Posted Wed Mar 19, 2014, 10:37am
Subject: Re: Have you heard about the new roaster from Denmark?
 

kboom1 Said:

I asked  Jonas the one marketing it on several forums What the roast times were doing a full 1k being it was only 1500w.

Here was his reply,

We have roasted 1kg Brazil, using just 1300w in 12 min.
As I remember it was 30-45sec into second crack.
Its definitely possible.
Jonas

Posted March 19, 2014 link

Since the heating element is inside of the drum I would speculate that if only using 1300 watts 120vac the drum must be heavily insulated.  I know that this is not the 1st time a heating element has been used INSIDE of the drum.  I believe many commercial drum roasters have IR gas inside the drum.  I experimented having an element in drum years ago with a small electric drum roaster I made for myself; the problem I had was that the heating element (a long conventional) did not provide uniform heat throughout its length and the resulting roast would be too dark on one side of the drum and too light on the other.  The issue was the proximity of the heating element to the beans; when much farther away the effect I encountered is vastly diminished. So I would imagine that Jonas has alleviated that issue in some way probably using a type of protected quartz element.  Still have the coffee oil issue where it gets burned onto the element diminishing its effectiveness.  Just speculating here.

Len

 
"Coffee leads men to trifle away their time, scald their chops, and spend their money, all for a little base, black, thick, nasty, bitter, stinking nauseous puddle water." ~The Women's Petition Against Coffee, 1674

www.CoffeeRoastersClub.com     www.javaPRO-CRC.com     www.KaffeeFrisch.com
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DavecUK
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Posted Wed Mar 19, 2014, 1:08pm
Subject: Re: Have you heard about the new roaster from Denmark?
 

NobbyR Said:

Roasting speed is pointless. Industrial hot air roasting is very fast and involves high temperatures, but the results are less compelling, while traditional artisan drum roasting is more time consuming and requires a lot of experience, but is capable of exibiting the aromas we are looking for in gourmet coffee.

I'm not saying that you cannot do this with this particular roaster. It's just that this statement is no sign of quality. It would be more interesting to know if it can do roasting profiles, for example.

Posted March 19, 2014 link

I fully agree about roasting speed, the big commercial boys love to roast 300kg in 8 minutes then water quench it to prevent it catching fire, or continuing to roast, it also allow them to dump it out fast. Not great at all for flavour, I get visions of a Bessemer converter and not a coffee roaster. They did the same with bread, it can now be made from ingredients to loaf in less than 2 hours, but it's not better and many people have forgotten what good/real bread tastes like.

Click Here (www.vinanhatrang.vn)

In one coffee chain I'm not going to name, the coffee is roasted so dark and tastes so crap, it's undrinkable, to me just carbonised water. I would have thrown those beans in the compost. BUT I see huge queues of the unknowing, buying from the uncaring and paying a high price for the undrinkable.

It may be a great roaster, but I'd want to spend a lot of time with it and see if it is....getting the beans to 1st crack as fast as possible isn't going to be my priority.
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Frost
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Posted Wed Mar 19, 2014, 3:15pm
Subject: Re: Have you heard about the new roaster from Denmark?
 

Giving a roast speed with the maximum batch size is a meaningful spec. It gives at least some indication of the heat transfer efficiency for the given batch size. You can spec any max batch size you want, ...even if it takes 20 minutes to bake or the beans scorch trying to pump enough heat into them for a reasonable profile.

Looking at the slide show, I'm wondering where the chaffe and smoke goes.
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oldgearhead
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Posted Wed Mar 19, 2014, 4:39pm
Subject: Re: Have you heard about the new roaster from Denmark?
 

Update: I've been told the 1500 watt heating element is not inside the drum.

I primarily brought this roaster to the reader's attention because of their unique energy usage claims.
I roast coffee in a 120 Volt, 1500 watt, heat-reclaiming, fluid-bed roaster, with an insulated RC,  and using 510F air as a heat source I can roast 500 gram loads
in 12 minutes. The claim that the 'Bullet' can roast twice my load volume and four times the Hot-top volume  using the same energy in the same time  is VERY significant.
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boar_d_laze
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Posted Wed Mar 19, 2014, 4:47pm
Subject: Re: Have you heard about the new roaster from Denmark?
 

Frost Said:

Giving a roast speed with the maximum batch size is a meaningful spec. It gives at least some indication of the heat transfer efficiency for the given batch size. You can spec any max batch size you want, ...even if it takes 20 minutes to bake or the beans scorch trying to pump enough heat into them for a reasonable profile.

Posted March 19, 2014 link

+1.  + very much 1.

In addition to the USRC in my profile, I have a Dalian Amazon 120V 1500W 1kg drum roaster.  It's slower than hell but has great airflow and airflow control.  Playing the dampers, you can pull a pretty good, slow, Central American style (i.e., very sweet and deep, but without much in the way of acidy nuance) roast out of it, as long as you don't exceed 750g.  

I've seen the Aillio blog and they're posting plots which appear like profiling, but as you know there's more to a profile than a BT line.  The long narrow shape of the roaster and the efficiency of the coil has me wondering about whether (a) the air flow is powerful enough for agility; (b) to maintain even heat throughout the roaster while pulling the smoke out; (c) whether 1500W is enough for a fast Ramp with enough fan to keep negative pressure in the roaster; and (d) a bunch of other, related stuff.  

Tough to get 1500W to do it all.  I'm not saying it's impossible, but I'd like to hear what some experienced people who drum-roast in a similar style to mine have to say.

Looking at the slide show, I'm wondering where the chaffe and smoke goes.

According to Jonas,

Yes, there is an exhaust. The pipe is just internal, and the fan is in the back. The exhaust will exit upwards from the back, and it will be possible to connect an adapter so you can connect a standard 3inch pipe.

The chaff collector is also in the back.

Rich
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