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Roasting time to first crack and 2nd Crack on the IRoast
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Abe_Carmeli
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Abe_Carmeli
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Posted Wed Nov 3, 2004, 6:18pm
Subject: Roasting time to first crack and 2nd Crack on the IRoast
 

Is there a rule of thumb as to the optimum roast time for entering first crack, and for clearing first crack, using the I-Roast?  Likewise how would the time between first and 2nd crack effect the roast?

 
Abe Carmeli
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brokencup
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brokencup
Joined: 18 Feb 2004
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Posted Thu Nov 4, 2004, 1:05am
Subject: Re: Roasting time to first crack and 2nd Crack on the IRoast
 

Your iRoast will probably get to first crack in between 4 and 6 minutes. It may make a difference on which end of that you push for but I don't think so. Jim Schulman recommends that from first crack to the end of roast should take between 3 and 6 minutes. Shorter than 3 and the results are thin and sour. Longer than 6 and the results are syrupy and lose complexity.

On the short side you total time should not be less than 8 minutes and on the long side not longer than 12 minutes.

Bob

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ChrisatCafeGreenBean
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ChrisatCafeGreenBean
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Posted Thu Nov 4, 2004, 1:21pm
Subject: Re: Roasting time to first crack and 2nd Crack on the IRoast
 

brokencup Said:

Your iRoast will probably get to first crack in between 4 and 6 minutes. It may make a difference on which end of that you push for but I don't think so. Jim Schulman recommends that from first crack to the end of roast should take between 3 and 6 minutes. Shorter than 3 and the results are thin and sour. Longer than 6 and the results are syrupy and lose complexity.

On the short side you total time should not be less than 8 minutes and on the long side not longer than 12 minutes.

Bob

Posted November 4, 2004 link

<naive new roaster speaking>

I understand those times are guidelines, but doesn't the roast method and type of coffee also change the target times?

I have just heard of some completing a roast in 6 minutes (say bright for drip) on say a Stir Crazy, and others taking 16 minutes or longer on a BBQ style for (say rounded for espresso).

I know everyone has their own ideas, just thought I confuse things more...

 
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JonR10
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Posted Thu Nov 4, 2004, 1:52pm
Subject: Re: Roasting time to first crack and 2nd Crack on the IRoast
 

ChrisatCafeGreenBean Said:

<naive new roaster speaking>

I understand those times are guidelines, but doesn't the roast method and type of coffee also change the target times?  

Posted November 4, 2004 link

It can indeed.

ChrisatCafeGreenBean Said:

I have just heard of some completing a roast in 6 minutes (say bright for drip) on say a Stir Crazy, and others taking 16 minutes or longer on a BBQ style for (say rounded for espresso).

Posted November 4, 2004 link

You're maybe a little confused.  No way anyone does a roast in 6 minutes on a Stir Crazy.  Using an airpopper one could roast to second crack in 6 minutes but using a Stir Crazy (with a convection oven lid) it's more likely to barely reach FIRST crack between 6 and 12 minutes (depends on particulars).  

My setup takes ~16-25 minutes to roast a pound of green.  I use it primarily for espresso but the drip coffee comes out great as well.  Roasting profiles are guidelines at best.  Keep a log, include entries about your taste experiences for diffferent beans at different roast profiles and in different blends.....etc....etc...

 
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scottfsmith
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Posted Thu Nov 4, 2004, 2:05pm
Subject: Re: Roasting time to first crack and 2nd Crack on the IRoast
 

My targets for iroasting these days is first crack at about 6:00, and a total roast not shorter than 12:00.  I did three different 9-minute roasts last weekend to city+/full city to experiment with shorter times, and all of them had an unpleasant sour note.  This was on a Columbian bean.  I have enjoyed 9-minute iroasts when the profile was hotter and I got to full city+/vienna in that time -- the beans are probably unevenly roasted, but it can still taste very good because you are at least out of the sour under-roasted phase.   In fact sometimes an uneven roast is better because even a single bean roast has a blend aspect to it from the different roast degrees, giving the coffee a richer flavor profile.

By the way, I believe there is a trade-off to consider between a longer first-second crack period with a less well-done roast at the end (e.g. to full city), and a shorter first-second gap with a higher final doneness (e.g. to vienna), in that the two have gotten a similar roast degree but there is not so much flavor burnt away in the former one.  I still need to do more experiments with this, but I have pulled some surprisingly good espresso shots from 15-minute i-roasts that never got into second crack.

Scott
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whodat1
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Posted Thu Nov 4, 2004, 2:33pm
Subject: Re: Roasting time to first crack and 2nd Crack on the IRoast
 

I'm still a novice at roasting & using the iRoast. Early on I would hit first in 3:30-4:30 and the 1st-2nd was taking about 3:30-4:00. Lately I've been getting to 1st from 5:30 to 6:30and 1st-2nd in 5:00-6:00.  I noticed a distinct improvement with the later times.

As far as I can tell from this forum, each iRoast is unique and a profile that works for one unit won't work well on another. I think the trick is to run a few batches trying to find out exactly how your iRoast responds to different profiles. If you ruin a few, just chalk it up to experience.

I had a few batches come out at one extreme or another and while I knew I could do much better, even these batches are better than OTB (Office Toxic Brew).

Jim
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bolojm
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Posted Fri Nov 5, 2004, 11:33am
Subject: Re: Roasting time to first crack and 2nd Crack on the IRoast
 

I just did my first roast on my new iRoast, and used my own "homegrown" profile.

2 min at 350
3 min at 400
7 min at 455

I think first crack happened at about 5 minutes into the roast, with second crack happeneing about 3:30 after that. I stopped the roast at 9 minutes, and it looks like I have a FC+ to Vienna roast (using the SM nomenclature). I used Sweet Maria's Monkey blend, and I did notice 3-4 beans which were underroasted (which I discarded). Looking forward to trying it!!
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DEchelbarger
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DEchelbarger
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Posted Fri Nov 5, 2004, 1:37pm
Subject: Re: Roasting time to first crack and 2nd Crack on the IRoast
 

I have learned a great deal from Sweet Maria's web pages, as most of us have.  I think we get too hung up on roast times in a fluid bed roaster.  While I've not done extensive tests, my i-roast does a wonderful job in comparison with my stove top manual popper where I routinely get longer roasts.  

I am going to quote Tom from Sweet Maria's just to add another voice to this conversation about roast times  in terms of taste:

"One last thought ... don't get hung up on overall roast times. 8 minutes, 11 minutes, 14 minutes ... it DOES NOT matter! Roast times are only relative to the method of transferring heat to the coffee. Air roasts are not supposed to be as long as drum roasts because they have the ability to transfer heat rapidly in a high velocity air stream. A drum has to conduct and convect heat to coffee much slower to avoid scorching. With the i-Roast, let the coffee be your guide in programming curves. Watch what the coffee is doing, and adjust your curves to what you observe. If you blast it with hot air, and 1st and second crack blur together. make adjustments. If you stall it, and the coffee just sits there, not developing but being exposed to heat, then you are baking it ... make a change. But a particular roast time is not a goal, and a 10 minute roast in one machine has not relevance to a 10 minute roast in another machine, not in terms of degree of roast, quality of roast, or cup quality."
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Abe_Carmeli
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Abe_Carmeli
Joined: 16 Mar 2004
Posts: 284
Location: New York
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Espresso: Expobar Brewtus modified...
Grinder: Versalab M3
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Posted Fri Nov 5, 2004, 5:53pm
Subject: Re: Roasting time to first crack and 2nd Crack on the IRoast
 

<<My targets for iroasting these days is first crack at about 6:00, and a total roast not shorter than 12:00.  >>

Scott,

What was your roast profile on the 12 minutes roast ?

Abe

 
Abe Carmeli
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brokencup
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brokencup
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Roaster: RK Drum
Posted Fri Nov 5, 2004, 6:17pm
Subject: Re: Roasting time to first crack and 2nd Crack on the IRoast
 

bolojm Said:

I just did my first roast on my new iRoast, and used my own "homegrown" profile.

2 min at 350
3 min at 400
7 min at 455

I think first crack happened at about 5 minutes into the roast, with second crack happeneing about 3:30 after that. I stopped the roast at 9 minutes, and it looks like I have a FC+ to Vienna roast (using the SM nomenclature). I used Sweet Maria's Monkey blend, and I did notice 3-4 beans which were underroasted (which I discarded). Looking forward to trying it!!

Posted November 5, 2004 link

Don't wait!  French press a sample right away and note the fragrance, aroma, nose and taste in your note book at multiple temps from full hot to cool. Compare at 24, 48 and 72 hours.

Bob
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