Mhansen Senior Member Joined: 14 Nov 2005 Posts: 36 Location: new york Expertise: I love coffee
Posted Mon Nov 14, 2005, 4:40pm Subject: Sour, bitter french press - Please help!
I'm going crazy trying to optimize my french press results to no avail; while I do taste the good tones of the coffee in my cup, they are overpowered by a bitter, sour taste. I'm not sure if it means anything, but I brew about 30oz of coffee, decant into two cups, and when I go to consume the second cup about 15 mins after the first, the taste is REALLY pronounced in that cup (obviously it's cooled a little bit).
Anyhow here's my setup:
Bodum french press (largest model) Starbucks barista (Solis 166) grinder Filtered water (have tried bottled too) brought to boil, taken off stove for 30 seconds before pouring Fresh beans - Intelligensia/Terroir, etc... right out of the bag Standard coffee ratio (1 heaped tablespoon for 4-6oz)
Now I've played with many different grinds and brew times, including the sweet marias 2 minutes w/fine grind, or the standard 4 minutes coarse. No matter what the funky taste is there.
My only guess (don't let this cloud your judgement, maybe it's something else) is it's the dust in the grinder, or possibly my coarsest setting is not coarse enough. The fact that my second cup really makes me want to puke (it's decanted when I pour my first cup, but there's still some sludge at the bottom which I presume extracts while it's sitting there for 15 mins or so) leads me to believe this. Regardless, the crappy taste is in my freshly poured first cup too.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated - if it is in fact my grind, how do I find out what a good baseline grind is for french press, and how much dust is acceptable for a coarse grind? Has anyone produced a good french press cup with the Barista grinder/Solis 166?
scubadoo97 Senior Member Joined: 24 Jun 2003 Posts: 655 Location: Florida Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Solis SL70 Grinder: Mazzer Mini & Solis Maestro... Drip: French Press/Clarity Roaster: SC/TO
Posted Mon Nov 14, 2005, 5:42pm Subject: Re: Sour, bitter french press - Please help!
Anyhow here's my setup:
Bodum french press (largest model) Starbucks barista (Solis 166) grinder Filtered water (have tried bottled too) brought to boil, taken off stove for 30 seconds before pouring Fresh beans - Intelligensia/Terroir, etc... right out of the bag Standard coffee ratio (1 heaped tablespoon for 4-6oz)
Sounds like you are doing every thing correct. I have a Solis Maestro Plus and have used grind settings from FP to drip and have experienced nothing that you described. FP coffee is a bolder taste so you may want to try less and even more coffee to water to see if either has a positive effect.
SL28ave Senior Member Joined: 19 Mar 2004 Posts: 770 Location: Rockville, MD Expertise: I live coffee
Grinder: Baratza Virtuoso Drip: Technivorm
Posted Mon Nov 14, 2005, 8:55pm Subject: Re: Sour, bitter french press - Please help!
Hi Michael,
It's hard to pinpoint the cause yet. If you e-mail me your addy, I can then snail-mail you our recommended FP grind particle size. That seems like a good first step.
Also, can you give me a little more history on your Terroir beans... region and roast style... mail order or retail.... roast date etc?... that would be helpful too.
Posted Tue Nov 15, 2005, 10:29am Subject: Re: Sour, bitter french press - Please help!
Michael, The only suggestion I have is to get yourself an instant read thermometer and make absolutely sure the water temp is between 195-205. I was using the "wait 30 seconds" rule for my FP too and discovered it was still too hot. I think it all depends on the apparatus used to heat the water. I use an All-Clad 1-qt pot which is very thick and retains heat, so it takes longer than 30 seconds to cool. Get that thermometer! Also, I'm not sure if you can still find them, but I have an extra fine-mesh filter for my FP that I bought from SM years a go. It helps further retain the finer grinds. You may want to look into it. And one last thing, scubadoo makes a good point. FP is bolder. I'm not sure what method you used before FP, but when I went from paper-filtered drip to FP, it took some getting used to - even when I finally got it right. The coffee was just bolder w/o that paper taste.
Good luck! Aurelio
ps. Hey, Peter, I sent you an e-mail about a week or so ago. No biggie - just an update. :)
Posted Tue Nov 15, 2005, 10:40am Subject: Re: Sour, bitter french press - Please help!
aurelio Said:
I was using the "wait 30 seconds" rule for my FP too and discovered it was still too hot. I think it all depends on the apparatus used to heat the water.
I use a tea kettle to heat the water. Once it's boiling, I take it off the burner and grind my beans. By the time I have them ground and in the FP, the water is perfect.
Of course, I'm using a Gaggia MDF grinder, so my grind time may take longer than someone who is using a better, quicker grinder.
Posted Tue Nov 15, 2005, 12:12pm Subject: Re: Sour, bitter french press - Please help!
I just did a FP try the other day, I used the same fresh roasted beans that I used for my TechV brewer. The difference in taste was really there, I used Panama Carmen beans from SM. They are full city roast. Now the FP tasted as if I did not let if sit long enough, 5 minutes. It did tasted a bit weak and not full flavored. Now with the TechV the coffee tasted great at first then it drops off to a bitter flavor within the same cup. Very different. I feel it was the beans and the general flavor with them.
CoffeeRoastersClub Senior Member Joined: 6 Jul 2005 Posts: 2,144 Location: Vernon Expertise: Professional
Espresso: Vintage La Pavoni Lever... Grinder: KitchenAid Pro Line Burr... Vac Pot: Vintage Silex Drip: Aeropress, French Press Roaster: "EL SUPREMO" w/QuikSPIN-CRC...
Posted Tue Nov 15, 2005, 12:45pm Subject: Re: Sour, bitter french press - Please help!
Mhansen Said:
I'm going crazy trying to optimize my french press results to no avail; while I do taste the good tones of the coffee in my cup, they are overpowered by a bitter, sour taste. I'm not sure if it means anything, but I brew about 30oz of coffee, decant into two cups, and when I go to consume the second cup about 15 mins after the first, the taste is REALLY pronounced in that cup (obviously it's cooled a little bit). ....snip......
I drink nothing but French Press. I observe that you are doing things much differently than I would. You should try the following, my recipe for a perfect cup of French Press:
2 1/2 Tablespoons very finely ground coffee per 8 oz. boiled water 1st Boil water. As water comes to boil, during that time grind your coffee. Then put it in your french press. Pour boiled water (settled) into french press. Give the mixture a good stir, then put the french press top on. Do not put down plunger until after 4 minutes has elapsed, at which time you push plunger down till it stops, taking 30 seconds time to do this. Pour out coffee and enjoy.
Posted Tue Nov 15, 2005, 1:14pm Subject: Re: Sour, bitter french press - Please help!
FWIW- here is my process:
- Fill FP with H2O (mine is 32oz) - Pour H2O into electric kettle and turn on - Insert temp probe with alarm set at 199 - Turn on hot water tap (takes a few min to warm up) - Put 6tbls grinds into grinder and grind - Re-Assemble FP from the day before - Clean my carafe from the day before and add hot tap water (to pre-heat) - Add hot tap water to FP and insert plunger (to pre-heat)
When alarm goes off: - Dump hot water from FP - Add Grinds - Add H2O which is now @205 - Slightly plunge FP so that all grounds are submersed (~1 inch) - Add in a little more H2O if I can fit it - Set Timer for 4-4.5 minutes
start eating breakfast... :)
When timer goes off: - Dump hot water from carafe - Pour contents of FP into carafe and close tightly
finish breakfast... :)
- Rinse off FP and let it air dry to be used the next day
I have had no problem with bitterness that I can recall....
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