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Palounek
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Joined: 19 Dec 2001
Posts: 6
Location: Austin
Expertise: Aficionado

Posted Thu Dec 21, 2006, 11:21am
Subject: keurig
 

Keurig -- we are looking for for experiences and comments concerning the Keurig k-cup machines, specifically when used with home-roasted freshly ground coffee and "smaller cup", about 4 oz. amounts of the brew. How does the quality of the coffee compare to the French Press and AeroPress methods?

Thank you for your help and suggestions.
Lubos in the Texas Hill Country part of Austin.

Moderator's Note: Moved to the Coffee Machines forum.
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wogaut
Senior Member
wogaut
Joined: 21 Sep 2004
Posts: 585
Location: Milwaukee
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: LM GS/3 MP
Grinder: Elektra Nino
Roaster: Hottop+PID
Posted Thu Dec 21, 2006, 11:38am
Subject: Re: keurig
 

I must have missed something...

the k-cup brewer uses "k-cups", readymade coffee capsules.
Do you fill your own capsules with home-roasted coffee? What is the purpose of this? Why not use a french press or drip machine with home-roasted coffee??? The k-cup is just another convenience shortcut to avoid coffee grounds, just like the Nespresso. I don't see a reason to go all the way to roast and grind your own coffee, just to use it in a crappy overpriced pseudo-drip machine.

W.
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Palounek
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Joined: 19 Dec 2001
Posts: 6
Location: Austin
Expertise: Aficionado

Posted Thu Dec 21, 2006, 12:31pm
Subject: Re: keurig
 

The answer is -- speed and convenience.

Our espresso machine would do the same things -- but it takes it a long time to heat up.  I still would use the espresso machine for really good espresso coffee or cappuccino - when there is time to do it properly, steam the milk, etc.

In other words - because Keurig makes the coffee or tea in just one minute.  Better than the three minutes plus using a French Press or four minutes or so using a single-cup "manual" drip coffee method, especially when in a rush in the morning, or when someone asks for just one cup of coffee or tea.  

I prefer the taste of the French Press coffee to the drip method coffee, but the sample I tasted from the Keurig was not worse when compared to the "single cup" manual dripped coffee and I guess better than from a "regular" several-cups dripped coffee makers.

The reason for the Keurig would be: convenience.  I think that the Keurig would make a cup of fresh tea and another cup of freshly ground coffee faster than using "regular" methods.

(I have no experience with the AeroPress, but want to get it for use when traveling.  Any comments to that?)

In the Keurig, I think that the K-cup has the advantage of coffee for guests who like "flavored coffee" and similar things (which I hate.) But some people like them, and I think that the Keurig may be a fast way to make several different cups of hot drinks without much effort..

Am I wrong?

Thanks for your opinion,  Lubos
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DigMe
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Joined: 27 Jan 2006
Posts: 2,059
Location: Waco
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Expobar Office Pulser,...
Grinder: Super Jolly, Mazzer Mini,...
Vac Pot: Bodum Santos
Drip: Capresso ST600, Presto...
Roaster: Behmor, SC/CO, Poppery I,...
Posted Thu Dec 21, 2006, 12:52pm
Subject: Re: keurig
 

So you can put your own ground coffee into a Keurig?  I don't know why but I thought they could only use some kind of capsules or something.  I don't know much about it though obviously.  

bc

 
ch-ch-ch-ch-ch
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Palounek
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Joined: 19 Dec 2001
Posts: 6
Location: Austin
Expertise: Aficionado

Posted Thu Dec 21, 2006, 1:10pm
Subject: Re: keurig
 

I am specifically thinking about the K-50 model, see its review at:
http://www.singleservecoffee.com/archives/000737.php

You can put your own ground coffee or loose tea into that model of Keurig.  Obviously, I have no practical experience with Keurigs except tasting its coffee at a demo.  That's why I am asking here for some advice.

Thank you for your input!

Lubos
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lparsons21
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Joined: 8 Jul 2006
Posts: 311
Location: Herrin, IL
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Izzo Alex
Grinder: Mazzer SJ, Ascaso i2,...
Roaster: Gene Cafe, Behmor,...
Posted Thu Dec 21, 2006, 2:20pm
Subject: Re: keurig
 

Here's a better place to find out more info on the Single Serve coffee makers :

http://www.singleservecoffeeforums.com/

 
Lloyd
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randomperson
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Joined: 16 Apr 2006
Posts: 312
Location: Boston and Vermont
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: La Valentina Levetta, Gaggia...
Grinder: Mazzer Mini E, Rocky...
Drip: Capresso MT500, Braun...
Posted Thu Dec 21, 2006, 8:38pm
Subject: Re: keurig
 

The Keurig makes the poorest excuse for "coffee" that I've ever tasted.  It creates a dark plasticky water that tastes simply horrific.  My condolences to you if you cannot taste the difference between what the Keurig produces and what a standard drip coffee pot produces, but if you can't taste the difference, then why bother asking about using your own ground coffee in it?  It would still taste like crap.

I'm not even going to qualify my comments with the usual "in my humble opinion."

Your guests can wait four minutes for coffee.  If they can't, or you can't be bothered, even Folgers instant coffee is better than Keurig and just as fast.
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Palounek
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Joined: 19 Dec 2001
Posts: 6
Location: Austin
Expertise: Aficionado

Posted Thu Dec 21, 2006, 10:33pm
Subject: Re: keurig
 

A "random person" states that Keurig "creates a dark plasticky water that tastes simply horrific. "

Thank you for that warning!  Do all Keurig models make coffee that tastes simply horrific?  Or does your comment apply only to certain Keurig models?

What does make it taste horrific? Wrong temperature?  Or what else?  When used with the "reusable K-Cup and filter basket ", and set for the "smaller" cup size, it seems to me that Keurig is in fact a small drip-coffee maker with "gold filter" and reasonably fast brewing time.  If you use fresh good water and very clean filter, I can't think about many other reasons for "horrific taste" other than either too high or too low temperature.  Can the Keurig's temperature by adjusted? Does the brewing temperature differ from machine to machine?

Thank you again for your comment and warning!

Lubos.
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randomperson
Senior Member


Joined: 16 Apr 2006
Posts: 312
Location: Boston and Vermont
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: La Valentina Levetta, Gaggia...
Grinder: Mazzer Mini E, Rocky...
Drip: Capresso MT500, Braun...
Posted Fri Dec 22, 2006, 6:11am
Subject: Re: keurig
 

I haven't tried all the Keurig models but I suspect the problems persist across the brand.  The reservoir plastic is the most persistent taste note in the coffee.  I think the primary issue for all of these types of coffeemakers is in fact the speed of the brew -- the coffee is therefore weak and underextracted.  Really, for an extra three minutes, why not make real, fresh brewed coffee?
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Palounek
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Joined: 19 Dec 2001
Posts: 6
Location: Austin
Expertise: Aficionado

Posted Wed Jan 3, 2007, 4:47pm
Subject: Re: keurig
 

In late December 2006, “random person” wrote here that "the Keurig makes the poorest excuse for "coffee" that I've ever tasted.  It creates a dark plasticky water that tastes simply horrific."

With due respect to the “random person”, (after all, somebody who uses Mazzer and Rocky mills should know the taste of good coffee), I believe that he or she was using a defective Keurig machine and I would like to read opinions of other coffee lovers.

We are eager to hear from others more about the quality of coffee properly brewed using the Keurig machine and the "reusable K-Cup and filter basket".

We have compared coffee brewed in a French Press and coffee brewed using the Keurig Ultra B50 with the Keurig reusable K-Cup and filter basket. Both the “French Press” coffee and the “Keurig” coffee had a very similar aroma and tasted almost the same; some people considered the Keurig brewed coffee to be slightly mellower. 2/3 of the people preferred the Keurig coffee, 1/3 preferred the French Press coffee, but all agreed that the aroma and taste are very, very similar.

We were using the same fresh water, the same beans, roasted (about 70 hours before the brewing) in the HotTop drum roaster (our machine is from the first batch of HotTops imported into the USA, those without the “safety” guards) to just the beginning of the second crack.  The coffee beans were ground minutes before the brewing in a Solis Maestro mill at the same “French Press” setting of the grinder.

For the French Press, we used:

• one coffee measure (7.25 grams) of coffee per 4 to 5 oz. water
• 195 to 200 degree F water
• 1 minute, briefly stir
• after another minute to 90 seconds, began to plunge

which is based on the method recommended by Tom Owen, see http://www.sweetmarias.com/brewinstr.frenchpress.html

For the Keurig Ultra B50 we used:

• 8.0 grams of coffee in the Keurig reusable K-Cup and filter basket
• the smaller brew size (5.25 oz. of water)

The Keurig literature claims that the Keurig Ultra B50 brews the coffee at the standard 192-degree Fahrenheit brew temperature, which seems to be acceptable, although slightly below the ideal recommended coffee brewing temperature of 195 to 200 degrees.

All the equipment is kept very clean, of course.

In my opinion, the “improvements” of the “newest” Keurig machines are marketing tricks and no real improvements, on the contrary:

The coffee should be brewed
• at 195 to 200 degrees of F – why give the user a choice of a lower temperature?
• at 7.25 grams off coffee per 4 to 5 oz. of water – why give the user a choice of over-extracted, bitter coffee?
 
To summarize:

It seems that good quality coffee used within a week from roasting and within minutes from grinding in a decent clean coffee mill, brewed in a clean Keurig using good quality water. the 195 degrees setting and the 5.25 oz. cup size setting will result in a cup of “French Press” quality coffee brew, which is better as compared to dripped coffee.

Let me repeat the basic requirements for a good coffee cup:

  1. high quality coffee
  2. used within a week from proper roasting (and quick cooling)
  3. used within minutes from grinding in a decent clean burr mill,
  4. used in a clean reusable K-Cup and filter basket
  5. brewed in a clean Keurig machine
  6. using good quality water
  7. using the 195 degrees F water temperature setting
  8. using the 5.25 oz. cup size
  9. and, of course, brewed into a clean cup

The importance of keeping everything very clean cannot be overstressed.

I believe that properly maintained and properly used Keurig machine can satisfy all those requirements. We are eager to hear opinions of others on this list. Thank you for your comments and opinions.

Lubos in the Texas Hill Country part of Austin.
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