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Now we know what GORT is (Behmor BraZen Brewer)
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germantownrob
Senior Member
germantownrob
Joined: 2 Dec 2007
Posts: 2,140
Location: Philadelphia
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Duetto 3, A Dead Oscar
Grinder: Vario-W, Preciso w/Esatto,...
Drip: Brazen
Roaster: Diedrich IR-1, HT B
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 7:59am
Subject: Re: Now we know what GORT is (Behmor BraZen Brewer)
 

cafedj Said:

That makes perfect sense.  What's not as obvious is why it would display 208 when I'm quite confident that water boils at very close to 212 in my location.  Does that mean it had drifted by 4 degrees?  My only concern was whether it's functioning as it should.

Posted January 3, 2013 link

I am in Philadelphia which is just above 250 feet elevation, I measure my water to boil at 210f-211f with accurate devices. So are you saying the Brazen when calibrated at 250 will no longer allow you to set the brew temp above 208f?

If salt lowers the boiling point could it be posiable that water being used could alter the calibration setting? edit: never mind, the coffe just kicked in, salt will raise the boiling point but probably not enough to measure.
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tahoejoe
Senior Member
tahoejoe
Joined: 9 Sep 2003
Posts: 601
Location: San Diego/ Incline Village Nv.
Expertise: I live coffee

Grinder: Solis Maestro
Drip: Behmor Brazen Brew System
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 8:06am
Subject: Re: Now we know what GORT is (Behmor BraZen Brewer)
 

cafedj Said:

That makes perfect sense.  What's not as obvious is why it would display 208 when I'm quite confident that water boils at very close to 212 in my location.  Does that mean it had drifted by 4 degrees?  My only concern was whether it's functioning as it should.

Posted January 3, 2013 link

A component has tolerances for example of +/- 3%, by calibrating we correct/ adjust the data supplied by that component to be accurate to a known baseline but it is impossible to permanently correct the component's deficiences in tolerances itself.

Thus each time you calibrate, you start from the beginning not from a previous point of calibration.

In a nutshell, you are reading into it too much.

 
REMINDER: Never leave the roaster unattended when in use !!   And remember to use our Rosetta Stone tip PART V PARAGRAPH 3.. it works !!!

www.behmor.com

Twitter: www.twitter.com/behmor
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/pages/Behmor-Inc/214061212036763#!
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cafedj
Senior Member


Joined: 3 Oct 2003
Posts: 653
Location: NC
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Bialetti, Aeropress
Grinder: Rocky doserless
Vac Pot: Bodum
Drip: Behmor Brazen
Roaster: Counter Culture
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 8:20am
Subject: Re: Now we know what GORT is (Behmor BraZen Brewer)
 

tahoejoe Said:

A component has tolerances for example of +/- 3%, by calibrating we correct/ adjust the data supplied by that component to be accurate to a known baseline but it is impossible to permanently correct the component's deficiences in tolerances itself.

Thus each time you calibrate, you start from the beginning not from a previous point of calibration.

In a nutshell, you are reading into it too much.

Posted January 3, 2013 link

As long as it's working as designed, and the 208 calibration display doesn't indicate a problem,  I'm good.  I've never seen a consumer level product include a calibration feature to compensate for component tolerances and drift, so just having that is a huge bonus.  I certainly didn't want to create some bogus issue.  More curiosity than anything.

Thanks.
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tahoejoe
Senior Member
tahoejoe
Joined: 9 Sep 2003
Posts: 601
Location: San Diego/ Incline Village Nv.
Expertise: I live coffee

Grinder: Solis Maestro
Drip: Behmor Brazen Brew System
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 8:38am
Subject: Re: Now we know what GORT is (Behmor BraZen Brewer)
 

germantownrob Said:

I am in Philadelphia which is just above 250 feet elevation, I measure my water to boil at 210f-211f with accurate devices. So are you saying the Brazen when calibrated at 250 will no longer allow you to set the brew temp above 208f?

If salt lowers the boiling point could it be posiable that water being used could alter the calibration setting?

Posted January 3, 2013 link

In plain speak, everytime you press calibrate you start all over..

Salt- talking with a chemist, salt raises the boiling point.

In tests a 30% salt solution raised boiling point appx 3F and obviously the coffee undrinkable! This was in fact part of our R&D process for the calibration equations.

 
REMINDER: Never leave the roaster unattended when in use !!   And remember to use our Rosetta Stone tip PART V PARAGRAPH 3.. it works !!!

www.behmor.com

Twitter: www.twitter.com/behmor
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/pages/Behmor-Inc/214061212036763#!
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tahoejoe
Senior Member
tahoejoe
Joined: 9 Sep 2003
Posts: 601
Location: San Diego/ Incline Village Nv.
Expertise: I live coffee

Grinder: Solis Maestro
Drip: Behmor Brazen Brew System
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 8:59am
Subject: Re: Now we know what GORT is (Behmor BraZen Brewer)
 

cafedj Said:

As long as it's working as designed, and the 208 calibration display doesn't indicate a problem,  I'm good.  I've never seen a consumer level product include a calibration feature to compensate for component tolerances and drift, so just having that is a huge bonus.  I certainly didn't want to create some bogus issue.  More curiosity than anything.

Thanks.

Posted January 3, 2013 link

We fully understand the questions that can come from new technology but what happens is when the question(s) is/are posted online versus being sent to us first or researched from available online resources (TIPS/FAQ Sheet) my office then gets flooded (as did occur)with people immediately assuming they have a broken unit, which doubles even triples our work load.

I'm as inquisitive as anyone and in fact I like that mind set, my concern is as mentioned because inadvertantly a "new issue" is created in the minds of some when there is no issue.

It's a tough balancing act and one we do understand..

 
REMINDER: Never leave the roaster unattended when in use !!   And remember to use our Rosetta Stone tip PART V PARAGRAPH 3.. it works !!!

www.behmor.com

Twitter: www.twitter.com/behmor
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/pages/Behmor-Inc/214061212036763#!
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cafedj
Senior Member


Joined: 3 Oct 2003
Posts: 653
Location: NC
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Bialetti, Aeropress
Grinder: Rocky doserless
Vac Pot: Bodum
Drip: Behmor Brazen
Roaster: Counter Culture
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 9:22am
Subject: Re: Now we know what GORT is (Behmor BraZen Brewer)
 

Sorry, didn't mean to create a support problem.  Love the machine.  Thanks for the response.
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JBMfiend
Senior Member


Joined: 3 Jan 2013
Posts: 2
Location: Colorado
Expertise: I live coffee

Grinder: Solis Maestro
Drip: Behmor Brazen
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 1:29pm
Subject: Re: Now we know what GORT is (Behmor BraZen Brewer)
 

Greetings all! New to CG but am an experienced coffee fanatic. Came here because I was looking for solution to problem with my brand new Brazen. Got it for Christmas. Brewed 7 pots and then had exactly the same issue as TK2FAST. 7 pots!! I dialed this machine in within 2 pots to a great cup of coffee but for $200 (granted it was a gift, but still...), I can't live with a brand new machine that leaves 1.5 to 2 full cups of water in the reservoir. I have seen this exact same problem in several forums so it is definitely an issue the has been called to Behmor's attention. I am working with Behmor support on the issue but no resolution yet - despite many great comments, I have found them to be a bit slow. TK2FAST and others...if you have been able to get your brewer to work properly (completely - i.e. leaving only about 2 tblsp water in the reservoir) would love to hear from you further.

Joe...what's up with this???

I REALLY want to love this machine and get it to work properly, but may have to return to the simplicity of the Technivorm.
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tahoejoe
Senior Member
tahoejoe
Joined: 9 Sep 2003
Posts: 601
Location: San Diego/ Incline Village Nv.
Expertise: I live coffee

Grinder: Solis Maestro
Drip: Behmor Brazen Brew System
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 3:45pm
Subject: Re: Now we know what GORT is (Behmor BraZen Brewer)
 

There are three reasons for water level you describe as being left in the reservoir.

1) bad valve- replace unit
2) small number of lids passed QC that were slightly oversized/ unbaked (since corrected) and creates vapor lock- easy fix new lid
3) unfiltered/ High mineral content in the water blocks a screen intended to prevent large particles from getting into the valve or other blockage (we've had paper towels/ lints etc) see attached- clean and use filtered water

The fixes on all 3 are simple.. thus the series of questions we ask.

tahoejoe: Valves mineral.jpg
(Click for larger image)

 
REMINDER: Never leave the roaster unattended when in use !!   And remember to use our Rosetta Stone tip PART V PARAGRAPH 3.. it works !!!

www.behmor.com

Twitter: www.twitter.com/behmor
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/pages/Behmor-Inc/214061212036763#!
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MJW
Senior Member


Joined: 25 Jul 2012
Posts: 179
Location: Silicon Valley
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 4:22pm
Subject: Re: Now we know what GORT is (Behmor BraZen Brewer)
 

cafedj Said:

... why it would display 208 when I'm quite confident that water boils at very close to 212 in my location.  ...

Posted January 3, 2013 link

Joe already answered this, but the short simple answer is that the "208" display is an uncalibrated "208".

Here's additional info on how calibration works:

The calibration step 1) boils water and 2) takes a reading from the sensor.  That sensor reading is matched to 212*F (if you said you're at sea level).  Subsequently, Brazen can take any reading from the sensor, and convert it to a scaled value between 0 and 212*F (again, if you said you're at sea level).

During calibration, Brazen doesn't know it's boiling the water.  It's just heating it up long enough that it must be boiling, then takes a reading from the sensor.  Now it knows what the sensor will read at the boiling point -- plus, it can now accurately convert sensor readings to temperature in *F or *C, because you told it the *F or *C at which water boils.
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tahoejoe
Senior Member
tahoejoe
Joined: 9 Sep 2003
Posts: 601
Location: San Diego/ Incline Village Nv.
Expertise: I live coffee

Grinder: Solis Maestro
Drip: Behmor Brazen Brew System
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu Jan 3, 2013, 4:32pm
Subject: Re: Now we know what GORT is (Behmor BraZen Brewer)
 

It's actually two fold..long enough so that data values remain constant. It could be long but if it (data stream/ values) are moving/ fluctuating the system will not accept until the data stream is stable for a set time

 
REMINDER: Never leave the roaster unattended when in use !!   And remember to use our Rosetta Stone tip PART V PARAGRAPH 3.. it works !!!

www.behmor.com

Twitter: www.twitter.com/behmor
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/pages/Behmor-Inc/214061212036763#!
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