pstam Senior Member Joined: 27 Jan 2004 Posts: 2,250 Location: Beijing Expertise: Professional
Espresso: ECM, SAN MARCO, EURO 2000 Grinder: MAZZER Vac Pot: YES Drip: YES Roaster: YES, HOME STYLE
Posted Tue Mar 29, 2005, 10:19am Subject: Acidity, one of the most important taste, or wrong taste of espresso
Acidity is one of the important characteristics of espresso, also for drip coffee. Considering the espresso, it happens both for the extra-extraction and for the low extraction.
But, as we train our baristas, we have to point it out that in most cases of wrong skills, it create acidity, which is much more strong than the normal acidity of the good espresso. So, when you feel the strong acidity, it is the problem from the wrong skill, or mistake.
Although most espresso has a certain acidity, it is noramlly very week, and so-called pleasent. But the strong and unpleasent acidity should be considered as the result of mistake of skills.
I don't know whether ever discussed it or not. So I just present it here and if anyone know the earlier discuss, or on somewhere else, please let me know. If not yet, I would like to know the opinions from all of you, because I supposed that it is very important when you taste your espresso and judge its quality.
Thanks in advance.
Peter in Beijing ------------------- http://www.kaffa.cn/ ------------------- I am looking for the way and the place to extend our trainning courses.
mikep Senior Member Joined: 9 Nov 2004 Posts: 728 Location: Illinois Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: Red Expobar OC / Gaggia... Grinder: Cimbali Jr/ Solis Maestro... Roaster: Hearthware Precision
Posted Tue Mar 29, 2005, 11:49am Subject: Re: Acidity, one of the most important taste, or wrong taste of espresso
I do not have a very good palate, but I think of 'acidity' as that 'bite' you can feel at the back of your throat. Is this what others think of for that term? I had some home roasted SM's French roast blend that had this characteristic.
kevinsp75 Senior Member Joined: 8 Jun 2004 Posts: 98 Location: Providence, RI Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Expobar Pulser Grinder: La Pavoni PGC Drip: Melitta #2 cone, Clarity,... Roaster: Coffee Exchange in...
Posted Tue Mar 29, 2005, 12:16pm Subject: Re: Acidity, one of the most important taste, or wrong taste of espresso
mikep Said:
I do not have a very good palate, but I think of 'acidity' as that 'bite' you can feel at the back of your throat. Is this what others think of for that term?
With regard to taste, I believe acidity has more to do with the mid-palate, as the taste receptors most sensitive to acids run along the sides of the tongue. You'll notice that anything particularly acidic will elicit a salivation response.
malachi Senior Member Joined: 5 May 2002 Posts: 1,761 Location: SFCA Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Monster Mia (for now)_ Grinder: Monster Cimballi Junior Vac Pot: Not any more Drip: never Roaster: Ecco, Stumptown, Intelli,...
Posted Tue Mar 29, 2005, 12:19pm Subject: Re: Acidity, one of the most important taste, or wrong taste of espresso
Acidity defined by Ken Davids
Taste those high, thin notes, the dryness the coffee leaves at the back of your palate and under the edges of your tongue? This pleasant tartness, snap, or twist, combined with an underlying sweetness, is what coffee people call acidity. It should be distinguished from sour or astringent, which in coffee terminology means an unpleasant sharpness. The acidy notes should be very clear, powerful and transparent in the Costa Rica, rich and wine- or berry-toned in the Kenya, and deeper-toned and muted in the Sumatra. They should be drier in the Costa Rica and perhaps a bit sweeter in the Kenya. Robustas and some lower-grown arabica coffees may display virtually no acidity whatsoever and consequently taste flat.
You may not run into the terms acidity or acidy in your local coffee seller's signs and brochures. Many retailers avoid describing a coffee as acidy for fear consumers will confuse a positive acidy brightness with an unpleasant sourness. Instead you will find a variety of creative euphemisms: bright, dry, sharp, brisk, vibrant, etc.
An acidy coffee is somewhat analogous to a dry wine. In some coffees the acidy taste actually becomes distinctly winy; the winy taste should be relatively clear in the Kenya. In promotional tags you may find the tones that I call winy described with other terms: fruity, dry fruit, and various specific fruit names, particularly berry and black current. The main challenge is to recognize the fundamental complex of fruit and wine-like sensations; once you do that, you can call them anything you like.
Acidity (in coffee terms) is not the same as acidic.
nyc_crema Senior Member Joined: 13 Oct 2004 Posts: 1,597 Location: New York City Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Alexia, Silvia Grinder: Mazzer Mini Roaster: Gorilla, Intelligentsia,...
Posted Wed Mar 30, 2005, 9:25am Subject: Re: Acidity, one of the most important taste, or wrong taste of espresso
pstam Said:
Although most espresso has a certain acidity, it is noramlly very week, and so-called pleasent. But the strong and unpleasent acidity should be considered as the result of mistake of skills.
Okay, this is my impression of this particular post:
I think pstam is using the term acidity correctly, and as far as I know, I use it correctly too. This is the hardest term to explain and also the most mis-used term too. I believe that pstam is reffering to how incorrect pulls give the shot more acidity than it should have which can be "corrupted" by a lack of body. I could be wrong, but lets use the ristrietto as an example. When done properly, the full acidity of the blend really comes out and void of bitterness/sourness/etc that ruins a drink. A perfect ristretto "punches you in the face" with its acidic charectoristics.
Now lets not talk about ristrettos, but regular pulls.
A regular pull, done incorrectly, will give you a bad shot (duh). Let's say a bad pull gives a shot that is extremely acidic (like a ristretto) but as a consequence the shot is also very bitter. You can taste the "floral" charectoristics of the shot, but you also get an overwhelming bitterness.
Am I on the right track here or completely retarded?
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