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Simply put: Espronography
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Discussions > Espresso > General > Simply put:...  
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MarkPrince
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Posted Fri Aug 20, 2004, 9:29pm
Subject: Simply put: Espronography
 

Today was a busy day for me - a visit to Ethical Bean in Vancouver, then an extended visit to Alistair's shop (Elysian Room) to further discuss the naked portafilter setup. Alistair mentioned he started formulating the idea a few weeks back when he was fooling around with removing spouts for the pour, but the catalyst was that Chris D, Kyle etc at Zoka posted something almost identical to what he was thinking about doing; Kyle posted the idea and implementation to the SCAA's Barista Board about three days ago. There's a funny story... Alistair read the post, and ran like a little schoolboy to Nathan, his friend and barista at his shop....

"Nathan! Nathan! Someone else cooked up the same idea I'd been thinking about for a few weeks, that portafilter surgery!!!"

Nathan apparently looked at him like his boss was on drugs :) :)

Neway, I've reserved comment on it till now, and I'm still kinda reserving comment until I do some of my own testing. But Hopkin lent me one of his naked portafilters for the weekend, and on Monday, I'm going to get one of mine hacked down (my LM portafilters are a slightly different design than Hopkins' more recent models).

But for now, here's a high res shot of what all the excitement is about.

Mark

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espressoDOM
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espressoDOM
Joined: 1 May 2003
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Posted Fri Aug 20, 2004, 9:36pm
Subject: Re: Simply put: Espronography
 

so Mark I am in love ... what are the plusses and minuses....

 
DOM...evil genius ...Up to no good in espresso at all times... VIVA la parts de Espresso
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MarkPrince
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Espresso: KvdW Speedster
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Posted Fri Aug 20, 2004, 9:39pm
Subject: Re: Simply put: Espronography
 

Another photo, another angle.

It's making me rethink my entire theory base behind tiger striping and tiger mottle on shots...

This one's right at the start of a shot...

Mark

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MarkPrince
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Joined: 19 Dec 2001
Posts: 5,628
Location: Vancouver, BC
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Espresso: KvdW Speedster
Grinder: Versalab M3 Grinder
Vac Pot: A bit too many
Drip: Bonavita
Roaster: Hario Glass Retro Roaster
Posted Fri Aug 20, 2004, 9:40pm
Subject: Re: Simply put: Espronography
 

And... ever wonder what channelling or pitting might look like?  Or, as my friend Cam says, "premature ejaculation" in the basket (lol!).

(again, I'm not developing any new theories yet as to whether this is channelling or not, but take a look at that JET of liquid coming out near the handle side)

Mark

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andys
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andys
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Posted Sat Aug 21, 2004, 3:14am
Subject: Re: Simply put: Espronography
 

MarkPrince Said:

And... ever wonder what channelling or pitting might look like?  Or, as my friend Cam says, "premature ejaculation" in the basket (lol!).

(again, I'm not developing any new theories yet as to whether this is channelling or not, but take a look at that JET of liquid coming out near the handle side)

Mark

Posted August 20, 2004 link


It would have interesting to have collected the coffee from that little jet separately, on a teaspoon. I wonder what it would have tasted like?

 
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JohnDoe
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Posted Sat Aug 21, 2004, 3:36am
Subject: Re: Simply put: Espronography
 

Did you do any side-side shot comparisons?  If so, did the shots with the naked portafilter taste better than a portafilter with its pants on?
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Javier
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Posted Sat Aug 21, 2004, 10:25am
Subject: Re: Simply put: Espronography
 

I just came back from Murky Coffee (http://murkycoffee.com/). Nick, the owner, was kind enough to let me compare shots between an unmodified LM portafilter and a “crotchless” LM portafilter. Each PF was fitted with a double basket. I “rinsed” my taste buds with water between sips.

Using the same blend, the shot from the “crotchless” PF was definitely sweeter than the one from the unmodified LM. The shot also had more mouthfeel to it. Of course, that is just my taste buds (subjectively) speaking. Also, the pour from the “crotchless” PF was awesome! Kind of makes you want to extend your tongue under the “crotchless” PF (insert your favorite porn joke here).

Thanks Nick!

Javier
Woodbridge, VA
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el_cabong
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el_cabong
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Posted Sat Aug 21, 2004, 1:29pm
Subject: Re: Simply put: Espronography
 

Well, I said I wouldn't do it to one of my La Marzocco portafilters, but I just couldn't help myself. I decided that I liked murkycoffee's approach so much, that I took my LM to a metal fabrication shop. I had work done at this shop before, so I knew they would do a great job. The modification turned out better than I could have hoped for, and the result in the cup is wonderful.  It cost me $30, money well spent!

I am no espresso expert, so I will say that I think the espresso is better, and I enjoy using this new naked portafilter.

Thanks to everyone at Zoka and murky for sharing their ideas and results.

Joel

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corey
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Posted Sat Aug 21, 2004, 2:27pm
Subject: Re: Simply put: Espronography
 

Thanks all for the photos and willingness to experiment. The naked PF would obviously pose a problem when wanting to split shots in a commercial environment, but for doubles this concept is incredible. I wonder what effect on temp the PF removal would make?  Temperatures of brewing and in the final cup I guess, could be affected. I love the idea that more crema is transported directly to the cup and the taste of a shot falling directly into the final cup rather than finding its way through metal channels surely would taste better. The other advantage is that old coffee oils are going rancid in the spouts (which are hard to clean well) therefore cleaning spouts and the bottoms of PF's is now redundant. I have a spare PF at work so it's off to the PF plastic surgeon!

Corey

PS Thanks for your input Mark, you know we were all waiting to hear what you had to say!

 
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el_cabong
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el_cabong
Joined: 11 Aug 2003
Posts: 396
Location: The Land of Enchantment
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Quickmill Vetrano
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Posted Sat Aug 21, 2004, 3:13pm
Subject: Re: Simply put: Espronography
 

corey Said:

I wonder what effect on temp the PF removal would make?  Temperatures of brewing and in the final cup I guess, could be affected.

Posted August 21, 2004 link

I have a theory about the temperature variable, hopefully I can explain it clearly.  Let's assume that there are two methods by which the temperature of the espresso could be affected, convection (the air around the filter basket and espresso) and conduction (the direct contact of the espresso and basket with the portafilter).

I think convection would have very little effect because the travel of the espresso through the air is only extended by a small distance than if it were going through the spout. In addition I don't think the air could affect the temperature of the grounds and basket enough to change the temperature of the extracted espresso. This is especially true in the design that Nick @ murky came up with, since only the very botom of the portafilter is missing. I think that in this particular situation, convection is not as efficient as conduction in the temperature change, so it's effect is not as critical.

I think that conduction has the most chance of changing the temperature of the extracted espresso. In a normal portafilter there would be two places conduction could affect the temperature. First, the direct contact of the basket with the portafilter would have a conductive effect on the temperature of the basket, and to the temperature of the ground coffee. Second the extracted espresso's contact with the portafilter and spout as it travels to the cup. Since the extracted espresso no longer has contact with the portafilter and spout at all, this method of conduction is eliminated completely, so it's no longer a variable in the temperature stability. So that leaves us with the conduction of temperature from the portafilter to the basket. I think that this conduction is not as critical since very little of the basket touches the portafilter anyway (look at the photo's of Zoka's design and you'll see it's basically the lip of the basket) and the place where the physical contact with the portafilter has not changed, so in theory the conduction to the basket will be basically the same. If my thinking is correct, the contact of the extracted espresso with the portafilter in a normal portafilter is what has the most influence on the temp of the extracted espresso.

All of this is completely theory and opinion, worth exactly what you paid for it.

Boy this is fun!

Joel

Edit: At this rate, I may need to change my "Expertise" to "I Live Coffee."
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