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Baratza Virtuoso Preciso VS Cunill El Cafe' Tranquilo
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Discussions > Espresso > Grinders -... > Baratza Virtuoso...  
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psychobrew
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Joined: 19 May 2011
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Location: Maryland
Expertise: I like coffee

Posted Mon May 30, 2011, 6:47pm
Subject: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso VS Cunill El Cafe' Tranquilo
 

I think I've narrowed my choices down to the Baratza Virtuoso Preciso and the Cunill El Cafe' Tranquilo.

The Tranquilo has 60mm commercial burs (vs 40mm or so for the Preciso).  The Preciso might have more grind settings, though I've heard you can stop in between 50 or 55 steps on the Tranquilo (basically stepless, but I don't have confirmation of that).  This will be used for espresso only.

Does anyone know what the difference between taste and convenience between these two machines would be?  I'm not overly worried about size or style.
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EricBNC
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EricBNC
Joined: 22 Jun 2010
Posts: 1,867
Location: North Carolina
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: QM Silvano, LP Stradivarius,...
Grinder: K30, Major, Preciso, Pharos,...
Vac Pot: Sunbeam C30, Bodum Santos...
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Posted Mon May 30, 2011, 8:27pm
Subject: Re: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso VS Cunill El Cafe' Tranquilo
 

How big of a hurry are you in?  I am going to sample espresso ground on the Tranquilo Thursday evening.  I would be glad to let you know what I find if this date falls inside your decision time window.

I do know the Cunill I will use has a doser - if you want a doser or not is a subject worth thinking about and also researching the pros, cons and general opinions for each option.

 
I chew coffee beans with my teeth while gargling with 195 F water to enjoy coffee. What is this "coffee brewing" device you speak of?
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psychobrew
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Joined: 19 May 2011
Posts: 93
Location: Maryland
Expertise: I like coffee

Posted Mon May 30, 2011, 8:37pm
Subject: Re: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso VS Cunill El Cafe' Tranquilo
 

No hurry.  I don't plan on placing my order until the middle of next month at the earliest anyway.

Definitely let me know.
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IMAWriter
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IMAWriter
Joined: 4 Jul 2002
Posts: 5,882
Location: Brentwood, TN
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Bezzera Strega
Grinder: Forte, OE Pharos,...
Vac Pot: Adcraft SS, Yama 8 cup
Drip: Brazen, Kalita, Chemex,...
Roaster: Behmor 1600, CO/UFO combo
Posted Mon May 30, 2011, 11:28pm
Subject: Re: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso VS Cunill El Cafe' Tranquilo
 

If I may, the Cunill is a fine, if "brutish" grinder. Not the prettiest, but with a couple of mods can produce excellent grind. It is NOT readily adjustable as is the Preciso, and unlike the Baratza grinders will produce a goodly amount of wasted grind, though the doser at least keeps it off the counter.

I assume you seen pictures of the Cunill. It is Spanish made, and from has been discussed here (and my ONE experience with it in California) have no problem with it as far as general quality of grind.

One important thing to consider is customer service. There is NONE better than Baratza. That said, if all you want to do is espresso, and you like the more industrial look of the Cunill, you will have a competent espresso grinder.

i would read CG's Consumer reviews on the Tranquilo to see what others have to say. There is much here about the Preciso, and now there is the Essato weigh scale option, so you can most accurately dose your shots consistently.


Edited for typos.

 
Rob J (LMWDP #187)
My Music Production web site:
www.robertjason.com
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psychobrew
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Joined: 19 May 2011
Posts: 93
Location: Maryland
Expertise: I like coffee

Posted Tue May 31, 2011, 6:15am
Subject: Re: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso VS Cunill El Cafe' Tranquilo
 

Is there a difference in taste between the two?

For the Preciso, I've read that it's prone to clumping at finer grinds.  What about build quality?  This won't be used in a commercial setting, but I still want something that will last a long while.

I do like how the Preciso will not waste grinds, but I've also read that the wasted grinds in the Tranquilo are easy to get out.  On the down side, the Tanquillo sounds like a pain to set up.  Does it even have a pulse button?
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Woody
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Woody
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Espresso: La Spaziale Vivaldi I
Grinder: Mazzer Major
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Drip: yuck
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Posted Tue May 31, 2011, 8:37am
Subject: Re: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso VS Cunill El Cafe' Tranquilo
 

I switched from the Tranquilo to a Mazzer Super Jolly,  and didn't really notice the improvement in the cup I was hoping for.   I haven't had experience with the Baratza, but can vouch for the Cunill- it is a good grinder.

Jon
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psychobrew
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Joined: 19 May 2011
Posts: 93
Location: Maryland
Expertise: I like coffee

Posted Tue May 31, 2011, 8:41am
Subject: Re: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso VS Cunill El Cafe' Tranquilo
 

Woody Said:

I switched from the Tranquilo to a Mazzer Super Jolly,  and didn't really notice the improvement in the cup I was hoping for.   I haven't had experience with the Baratza, but can vouch for the Cunill- it is a good grinder.

Jon

Posted May 31, 2011 link

Wow.  Does the Tranquilo offer enough adjustments?  I've heard it's got something like 55 settings, but I've also heard newer models have steps in between each setting.  Cunill's web site is horrible about details like this (and the Sovrana Store is just as bad).
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cbowers
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cbowers
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Espresso: Expobar Brewtus III,...
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Posted Tue May 31, 2011, 1:39pm
Subject: Re: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso VS Cunill El Cafe' Tranquilo
 

I guess you'd have to "weigh" the convenience of the option of adding the Esatto base to the Baratza.  Certainly having preset dosing by weight might by a convenient option to play with.

My only caveat is I'm guessing the Preciso may share much of the internals as the Virtuoso (extra fine adjust excepted).  Granted I've had mine since 2006/7, but I've found I've had to put a number of parts through it.

This week saw the second main worm drive gear go on it, and the 3rd upper burr carrier.  I think I'm on the second lower adjustment  collar/disk.

Both main gear replacements I think were in the middle of plowing through a bag of peaberry (no rocks, just dense beans).

Can't speak for the Preciso, but on the Virtuoso, it's simple to remove the plastic detent pin, and have stepless increments.  It's stiff enough to hold it's position, and is somewhat important when you live in millimeters between settings 0 and 2 for espresso.

It's pretty simple to self service, and I haven't had any trouble getting parts locally in Metro Vancouver.

But I think I may look at moving to the Vario-E when it ships.
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psychobrew
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Joined: 19 May 2011
Posts: 93
Location: Maryland
Expertise: I like coffee

Posted Tue May 31, 2011, 5:22pm
Subject: Re: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso VS Cunill El Cafe' Tranquilo
 

cbowers Said:

I guess you'd have to "weigh" the convenience of the option of adding the Esatto base to the Baratza.  Certainly having preset dosing by weight might by a convenient option to play with.

My only caveat is I'm guessing the Preciso may share much of the internals as the Virtuoso (extra fine adjust excepted).  Granted I've had mine since 2006/7, but I've found I've had to put a number of parts through it.

This week saw the second main worm drive gear go on it, and the 3rd upper burr carrier.  I think I'm on the second lower adjustment  collar/disk.

Both main gear replacements I think were in the middle of plowing through a bag of peaberry (no rocks, just dense beans).

Can't speak for the Preciso, but on the Virtuoso, it's simple to remove the plastic detent pin, and have stepless increments.  It's stiff enough to hold it's position, and is somewhat important when you live in millimeters between settings 0 and 2 for espresso.

It's pretty simple to self service, and I haven't had any trouble getting parts locally in Metro Vancouver.

But I think I may look at moving to the Vario-E when it ships.

Posted May 31, 2011 link

You hit the nail on the head.  The Preciso is a consumer unit and I'm afraid it's built like one.  The burrs are an improvement over the regular Virtuoso though, and while I've read the burrs are commercial quality I'm not sure how many commercial units use 40mm burrs.  Still, I don't doubt the quality of the grind.  It also looks like a convenient grinder where the Tranquilo looks like it might be a pain (does it even have a pulse setting or is operation controlled solely by the inaccessible timer)?

Oh well, I have plenty of time to research.
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IMAWriter
Senior Member
IMAWriter
Joined: 4 Jul 2002
Posts: 5,882
Location: Brentwood, TN
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Bezzera Strega
Grinder: Forte, OE Pharos,...
Vac Pot: Adcraft SS, Yama 8 cup
Drip: Brazen, Kalita, Chemex,...
Roaster: Behmor 1600, CO/UFO combo
Posted Tue May 31, 2011, 9:03pm
Subject: Re: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso VS Cunill El Cafe' Tranquilo
 

The Preciso was designed as a home grinder, though in fairness the Tranquilo's lack of niceties makes it mostly unworkable in the commercial workplace.
I have read here that several commercial establishments ARE utilizing the Preciso/Essato combination for their manual pour/press pot/vac pot grinding, due to it's ability to grind to the precise weight required....over and over.

From a pure user stand point I'll stand by my PERSONAL experience that having owned and used the fine Mazzer SJ for 5 years, I find the Baratza lineup overall more convenient and equally worthy of producing an excellent grind, with less waste.





EDIT...I must make note here that I carry along a wee bit of bias in favor of Baratza in general, based in large part upon their insistence on providing the best customer service possible...their willingness to go the extra mile for their customers.
There are other relevant choices in grinders, and I always urge anyone considering the purchase of a new grinder to read the reviews, while considering THEIR own pattern of use. I believe Baratza has fully examined the needs of the average home coffee aficionado and provided elegant solutions for all types of grinding, first with the Vario and now the Preciso.

 
Rob J (LMWDP #187)
My Music Production web site:
www.robertjason.com
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