ryandunlap Senior Member Joined: 15 Sep 2009 Posts: 104 Location: Syracuse, NY
Posted Sat Feb 11, 2012, 5:46am Subject: Re: Can I get some feedback on my pours...
Beyond pour technique, I'm guessing I've been spending too much time introducing air into the milk. I read how themadtamper only does 3-4 seconds. I have probably been doubling that.
Posted Sat Feb 11, 2012, 3:33pm Subject: Re: Can I get some feedback on my pours...
ryandunlap Said:
Beyond pour technique, I'm guessing I've been spending too much time introducing air into the milk. I read how themadtamper only does 3-4 seconds. I have probably been doubling that.
Something that you may not have considered, but that makes a huge difference when it comes to latte art, is bean age.
Beans that are too fresh off the roast make a gassy crema which will bubble up to the top and destroy art quickly. You should find that the pours look tighter on beans which are aged past 7 days post roast.
ewolfe Senior Member Joined: 27 Feb 2011 Posts: 15 Location: Grand Forks, ND Expertise: I like coffee
Posted Sat Feb 11, 2012, 4:41pm Subject: Re: Can I get some feedback on my pours...
I notice two things: 1) the art is rather bubbly; and 2) the lines are somewhat indistinct. As the previous poster commented, the bubbles could come from a bubbly shot; they could also come from the milk. While you might have too much air total (which you're concerned about), you might also might just not be getting the milk effectively mixed enough during the 2nd whirlpooling stage. Does your milk seem the same consistency throughout your pour, or do you have a bubblier surface on top and thinner milk underneath?
One explanation for the thin lines, in fact, is that you haven't introduced enough air in the first stage. You mention themadtamper's comments, but it's very hard to adjust your own technique according to someone else's timing. Machines and technique vary widely. Depending upon your machine's steam power, how much milk you're using, how quickly you are introducing air, and so on, you might need more than double his time to get similar effects. Actually, that's my best guess from your pictures. Your milk is still a little thin overall and perhaps not consistently mixed.
Pour technique can also affect the lines, of course. All other things being equal, a lower, faster pour will typically produce a thicker line; a higher, slower pour will produce a thinner line.
Interesting, I didn't know that. That explains a lot. (See below, Counter Culture about ten days old---vs the above photos that are Metropolis Redline, three days old.)
ewolfe Said:
Actually, that's my best guess from your pictures. Your milk is still a little thin overall and perhaps not consistently mixed.
I think you're right. I adjusted my technique to add more and fold a little longer. The problem I'm having is I like my cappas between 125-135, and so it doesn't give me much folding time. (Likely answer: just more practice!) Thanks!
Posted Sun Feb 12, 2012, 3:39pm Subject: Re: Can I get some feedback on my pours...
ryandunlap Said:
Interesting, I didn't know that. That explains a lot. (See below, Counter Culture about ten days old---vs the above photos that are Metropolis Redline, three days old.)
Three day old redline is way too gassy for art. (Speaking from experience) I'd wait til day 6.
ryandunlap Said:
I think you're right. I adjusted my technique to add more and fold a little longer. The problem I'm having is I like my cappas between 125-135, and so it doesn't give me much folding time. (Likely answer: just more practice!) Thanks!
The answer here is to fold while stretching. If your milk is not "spinning" I.E. a circular turning motion at all times, you wont be able to get that glossy perfectly smooth top on your drinks.
My machine takes about 7-8 seconds to take a pitcher to 145, so spinning while stretching is a must. I probably only sink the wand for 1.5-2 seconds at most.
- James
Edit: I forgot to mention. If your shot finishes more than 8 seconds before your milk or vice versa, the art will suffer. The optimum is five seconds or less gap between end of the shot and the end of the steaming.
ewolfe Senior Member Joined: 27 Feb 2011 Posts: 15 Location: Grand Forks, ND Expertise: I like coffee
Posted Wed Feb 15, 2012, 4:19pm Subject: Re: Can I get some feedback on my pours...
Second pics look a lot better--nice work!
JtothaR Said:
My machine takes about 7-8 seconds to take a pitcher to 145, so spinning while stretching is a must. I probably only sink the wand for 1.5-2 seconds at most.
There's an illustration of how different things can be. I have a Silvia V3, and I was curious about how long it takes me, so I timed myself today. I'm steaming probably about 5-6 ounces of 2% milk (of which I pour about 4 ounces), and it takes 35 seconds or so to get to 140. I'm stretching (and spinning, as James suggests) for almost exactly the first half of that, and then just spinning for the remainder.
With the Silvia, and the temp-surfing involved, that also means I'm way off from James's optimum gap between the end of the shot and the end of the steaming.
Here's today's pour (which also reminded me that bubbles can be a sign of how long it takes to get the camera!):
Symbols: = New Posts since your last visit = No New Posts since last visit = Newest post
Forum Rules: No profanity, illegal acts or personal attacks will be tolerated in these discussion boards. No commercial posting of any nature will be tolerated; only private sales by private individuals, in the "Buy and Sell" forum. No cross posting allowed - do not post your topic to more than one forum, nor repost a topic to the same forum. Who Can Read The Forum? Anyone can read posts in these discussion boards. Who Can Post New Topics? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post new topics. Who Can Post Replies? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post replies. Can Photos be posted? Anyone can post photos in their new topics or replies. Who can change or delete posts? Any CoffeeGeek member can edit their own posts. Only moderators can delete posts. Probationary Period: If you are a new signup for CoffeeGeek, you cannot promote, endorse, criticise or otherwise post an unsolicited endorsement for any company, product or service in your first five postings.
![ryandunlap: art.jpg](javascript:ImagePopup("/images/56466/art.jpg", 1280, 720, "ryandunlap: art.jpg");)
![ryandunlap: art2.jpg](javascript:ImagePopup("/images/56493/art2.jpg", 1117, 512, "ryandunlap: art2.jpg");)
= No New Posts since last visit 