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V3 Silvia wand on Gaggia Classic?
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Discussions > Espresso > Espresso Mods > V3 Silvia wand...  
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selzoc
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Joined: 21 Jul 2009
Posts: 44
Location: RTP
Expertise: Just starting

Posted Fri Dec 14, 2012, 7:35am
Subject: Re: V3 Silvia wand on Gaggia Classic?
 

Please do!  Back when I had a Classic, I ended up just using the V2 Silvia wand, and that made a great difference.  But I'd like to check out what you'd have to do for a V3.
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daduck748
Senior Member


Joined: 13 Dec 2012
Posts: 157
Location: California, USA
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Gaggia Classic (2012)
Grinder: Breville BMF600XL
Posted Fri Dec 14, 2012, 11:47am
Subject: Re: V3 Silvia wand on Gaggia Classic?
 

So far, so good.  I just removed my stock steam wand last night, and it was a cinch.  I only used one pair of pliers and the nut came right off.  It was nearly finger tight.  If others NEED to use 2, then there may be a QA issue at Gaggia, but that's neither here or there.

Yep, the stock nut will not come out without bending the pipe or as I've seen in a YouTube video, saw it in half to retrieve it.  I'm electing to preserve everything, in case... of anything.  So my adapter will replace the stock nut.  Come to think of it, it's not a nut at all.

And as luck would have it, my camera ran out of batteries and I didn't take any photos - yet.  But at this stage, it doesn't look any different than what we've all already seen.

However, I may also fabricate an adapter to connect a pressure gauge, while I'm at it.  I've done the hose bit and even with several hose clamps hugging the pipe, the pressure still eventually caused leaks and basically exploded, leaving me a mess to clean up.  A hard install would work 100x better.

I hope to have the design done and drawn up early next week, and go get some material.  I picked up some 3" x 8" x 3/8" brass for another project and GEEZ, brass is expensive, next to copper!

I'll keep everyone posted.

 
Gaggia Classic
Breville BMF600XL
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daduck748
Senior Member


Joined: 13 Dec 2012
Posts: 157
Location: California, USA
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Gaggia Classic (2012)
Grinder: Breville BMF600XL
Posted Fri Dec 14, 2012, 2:48pm
Subject: Re: V3 Silvia wand on Gaggia Classic?
 

selzoc Said:

Please do!  Back when I had a Classic, I ended up just using the V2 Silvia wand, and that made a great difference.  But I'd like to check out what you'd have to do for a V3.

Posted December 14, 2012 link

Oh, by the way, I was originally going to put the V2 on my Classic, but the only stock that I could find was someone in UK selling them on eBay for a lot more money (plus shipping and travel time) than I wanted to afford.  Then I found the V3 on Espresso Parts (V3 looks cooler anyway) then found this site.  Another deciding factor was I felt this was a worthy mod, and according to Espresso Parts, the V2 is 1) out of stock and 2) being phased out... so V3 it is!

 
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daduck748
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Joined: 13 Dec 2012
Posts: 157
Location: California, USA
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Gaggia Classic (2012)
Grinder: Breville BMF600XL
Posted Fri Dec 14, 2012, 4:47pm
Subject: Re: V3 Silvia wand on Gaggia Classic?
 

OK... so I got side tracked.  You can't blame me.  I'm still waiting for my V3 steam wand.

daduck748: IMG_2061.JPG
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daduck748
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Joined: 13 Dec 2012
Posts: 157
Location: California, USA
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Gaggia Classic (2012)
Grinder: Breville BMF600XL
Posted Fri Dec 14, 2012, 4:48pm
Subject: Re: V3 Silvia wand on Gaggia Classic?
 

All Home Depot parts, except the gauge.  I got the gauge from McMaster.  I can't wait to try it out.  I'm gonna have to get a Classic for the office... --> Christmas List?

The spout is threaded on there.  It is indeed 3/8 NPT, as I've read elsewhere, which made this a quick project.  The longest part was driving to Home Depot to get the parts.  The gauge is a 1/8 NPT, but 1/4 NPT is probably more common.  For me, the spout was fairly easy to get off since I have a 15,000lb CNC machine equipped with several vises, but I couldn't imagine the average Joe doing this at home.  Actually, I can because I tried last night with a pair of vise-grips... it wasn't coming off.

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daduck748
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Joined: 13 Dec 2012
Posts: 157
Location: California, USA
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Gaggia Classic (2012)
Grinder: Breville BMF600XL
Posted Fri Dec 14, 2012, 5:07pm
Subject: Re: V3 Silvia wand on Gaggia Classic?
 

Back on topic, on the way back from Home Depot, I stopped by my local metal supply shop to get the 3/4" hex stock.  They looked at me square when I said I just needed a foot and they asked what it's for, since they know me there and I said, "Don't ask.  It's for an espresso machine."

Obviously, on the left, we have the stock steam wand in all its glorious corrosion and/or possibly milk residue from when I first got the machine.

Next to it is a M10-1.0 hex head bolt that I got from Home Depot to use as a working gauge.  It certainly does look like M10-1.0 (Again, thank you AMB for the dimensions).

And next to it is the 3/4" brass hex stock.

I may mill the adapter, since I just moved into my new facility and only the machining center is hooked up.  I'm waiting for the lathe to get connected.

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hotwasabipeas
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hotwasabipeas
Joined: 19 Aug 2011
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Location: Ohio
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: NS Oscar
Grinder: KitchenAid ProLine
Drip: Keurig Vue, B70,Tassimo T65,...
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Posted Fri Dec 14, 2012, 11:23pm
Subject: Re: V3 Silvia wand on Gaggia Classic?
 

Nice pressure gauge setup!  I want to check the pressure on my KitchenAid Proline (basically it's a dual boiler Gaggia Classic) and was wondering if you could let me know exactly what parts I will need from Home Depot?  I have a feeling if I go there not knowing EXACTLY what parts I need I'll never find them...that store scares me!

 
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daduck748
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Joined: 13 Dec 2012
Posts: 157
Location: California, USA
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Gaggia Classic (2012)
Grinder: Breville BMF600XL
Posted Sat Dec 15, 2012, 3:17am
Subject: Re: V3 Silvia wand on Gaggia Classic?
 

Wasabi,
I don't have the part numbers with me, but here is what you will need:

From the plumbing department (near the sinks):
- 3/8 NPT elbow (male/female)
- 3/8 NPT coupler (female/female)
- 3/8 NPT to 1/4 NPT adapter (mine is 1/8 NPT since my gauge is 1/8 NPT)
- teflon tape

From the tools section (air tools):
- 160 psi pressure gauge (1/4 NPT, I think this is all they carry)

Loosely assemble everything before you finalize it on the PF.  Assemble in this order:
- 3/8 NPT to 1/4 NPT adapter to 3/8 NPT coupler
- 3/8 NPT coupler to 3/8 elbow
- 3/8 NPT elbow to PF
- pressure gauge to the 3/8 NPT to 1/4 NPT adapter

Make sure you do NOT have a basket installed when using your new pressure gauge.  You will have a horrible water leak (more like water falls).  Don't ask me how I know this.  Having said this, you shouldn't need to use this very often (I'll probably use it at least once every few months to keep my coffee consistent).  The baskets' lip is softer on the gasket than the PF edges, so watch out for this.

Make sure the entire assembly is filled with water (remove all air bubbles) and fill the PF about half way before installing it into the espresso machine.  With bubble, your reading can be all over the place.  If not, you will have about +/-20-30 psi swing.  With bubbles removed, you should get +/-5-10 psi swing.

Also, make sure you have a fairly new gasket.  I changed mine this evening, since it was time (3-4 months).

Point of reference:
Initial reading was well over 160 psi (11+ bar).
Ultimately adjusted to 145 psi (~10 bar).

Subjective test results, the wife said it was the "best coffee yet", then I told her the only difference was the adjustment in shot pressure.  Next is the PID.  After that, TDS reflow.

Now I need a spare PF for backflushing.  With the gauge installed, backflushing/dumping is a bit awkward.

 
Gaggia Classic
Breville BMF600XL
Ducati Hypersport 748r
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daduck748
Senior Member


Joined: 13 Dec 2012
Posts: 157
Location: California, USA
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Gaggia Classic (2012)
Grinder: Breville BMF600XL
Posted Mon Dec 17, 2012, 1:49pm
Subject: Re: V3 Silvia wand on Gaggia Classic?
 

Here's an update.  I got the CNC lathe up and running.  I'm still waiting for the V3 steam wand to arrive.  It should be any day now.

 
Gaggia Classic
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daduck748
Senior Member


Joined: 13 Dec 2012
Posts: 157
Location: California, USA
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Gaggia Classic (2012)
Grinder: Breville BMF600XL
Posted Tue Dec 18, 2012, 6:23pm
Subject: Re: V3 Silvia wand on Gaggia Classic?
 

I hate FedEx.  My steam wand's delivery date has changes.  I'm sure everyone has noticed how FedEx's website always states "Estimated Delivery Date", and 9 times out of 10, they always miss it?  I'm not a huge fan of UPS, but at least, 9 times out of 10, they ARE on time.

Anyway, more delays on the V3 adapter.

By the way, I do know espresso parts has a 1/8 BSP to 3/8 BSP adapter.  I did order one just to try it out, but that's probably going to be delayed as well.  I did read someone already tried the BSP adapter and they said something like "I would not recommend going this route".  It may or may not work.  That's why I decided to order one anyway.

My thoughts on my adapter.
- The adapter should be able to accommodate an o-ring on both sides to prevent leaks and maintain steam pressure.
- The adapter should be able to accommodate the swivel ball and spring on the V3 side.  This is only a guess since I see these sold on EspressoParts, and in the V3 photos, plus AMB's writeup above.
- Material is brass to maintain a food-safe product and minimize/eliminate corrosion where we can control it.  Copper and aluminum would corrode in time, and steel would cost too much in machine-time.

Thoughts on metric vs BPS threads.  I'm not sure if these readily available adapters are a good fit or not, but I'm starting to test them out.  Here is some metric/BPS math and to get everything into the same units for comparison.

1/8" BSP = 28TPI (teeth per inch), which equates to ~0.036" (0.907mm) between teeth.  1/8" BSP Major Diameter is 0.383" (9.728mm).
3/8" BSP = 19TPI, which equates to ~0.053" (1.337mm) between teeth.  3/8" BSP Major Diameter is 0.656" (16.662mm)

M10-1.0 = 25.4TPI which equates to ~0.039" (1.0mm) between teeth.  M10 Major Diameter is 0.394" (10mm).
M18-1.5 = 16.9TPI which equates to ~0.059" (1.5mm) between teeth.  M18 Major Diameter is 0.709" (18mm).

So the thread sizes are very close.  Probably close enough to work.  The M10 (1/8" BSP) seems to be right there, maybe a little loose, but according to the numbers, the M18 (3/8" BSP) side would be pretty loose.

Can someone comment on the fit of the 1/8" BSP to 3/8" BSP adapter?

 
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