Teme Senior Member Joined: 7 Jan 2005 Posts: 1,221 Location: Finland Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Izzo Alex Duetto II Grinder: Mahlkönig K30 Vario
Posted Sun May 29, 2005, 3:14pm Subject: Re: Timing the cooling flush on E61 machines?
I would like to thank everyone for their very constructive input. I guess there was an overflow of information (at least for me) and it is quite clear that there are several approaches to the cooling flush routines on E61 machines, a number of which will probably achieve the same goal. In the end, I have adopted the one researched and posted by Bob Yellin in this thread: "Fine Tuning Brew Temperature on a Heat Exchanger Machine - A Workable Solution"
This routine seems to work for me and the quality and consistency of my shots has improved greatly. If and when I want to go further, I will do my own measurements (I'll need to buy a multimeter with a TC) perhaps mostly out of curiosity but also to check if the fact that my machine is 220V vs Bob's 110V makes a difference (especially in the recovery times).
MOSFET Senior Member Joined: 31 Dec 2003 Posts: 376 Location: Long Island, NY Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: Linea Grinder: Mazzer Mini Vac Pot: Hoover Drip: Post-nasal Roaster: Perdue Oven-Stuffer
Posted Tue May 31, 2005, 8:35am Subject: Re: Timing the cooling flush on E61 machines?
I've been in and out of the thermocouple approach, and now, like Dan, I "use the force". After speaking at length with an older Italian cafe owner about machines, I've come to use the more laid back approach. He told me, "You need a little steam to make it taste right." Since then I've backed up considerably on the flush amount and I make sure it's still steaming a little when I shut it off. The flow, color, and taste are always better than if I let it completely settle. And if I let it settle and then wait two more seconds it's always sour. I just practice seeing how much it's steaming before shutting off the preflush and correlate with taste.
Posted Tue May 31, 2005, 2:14pm Subject: Re: Timing the cooling flush on E61 machines?
Keith,
Do i understand it correctly, that you with this method of yours, is pulling the shot right after the flush? No waiting 30-45 seconds after the flush?
I do the cooling flush (amount depends on how long the machine has been ideling), wait 30-45 seconds and pull. I would like to try your approch, just want to be sure to do it right... So, flush until the water almost settles, and pull the shot immideatly hereafter?
MOSFET Senior Member Joined: 31 Dec 2003 Posts: 376 Location: Long Island, NY Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: Linea Grinder: Mazzer Mini Vac Pot: Hoover Drip: Post-nasal Roaster: Perdue Oven-Stuffer
Posted Wed Jun 1, 2005, 8:34am Subject: Re: Timing the cooling flush on E61 machines?
krumbak Said:
Keith,
Do i understand it correctly, that you with this method of yours, is pulling the shot right after the flush? No waiting 30-45 seconds after the flush?
I do the cooling flush (amount depends on how long the machine has been ideling), wait 30-45 seconds and pull. I would like to try your approch, just want to be sure to do it right... So, flush until the water almost settles, and pull the shot immideatly hereafter?
Actually I'm not that exact. I don't do it immediately on purpose, but I also don't wait a set amount of time. If I had to guess I'd say I typically wait 10-20 seconds after I stop it before starting the shot, just because I'm spending time grinding and tamping. Just have fun experimenting! But I wouldn't use too much steam if your roast is particularly dark.
Posted Wed Jun 1, 2005, 11:56am Subject: Re: Timing the cooling flush on E61 machines?
Keith,
Thanks. I am experimenting... a lot! :) It is all part of the fun, i was just looking for some pointers on doing it differently or in some other way.
I flushed a little less today - flow just settled down. Pulled the shot about 10 seconds later, had to place filterbasket in PF first. I had already dosed and tamped, as not to waste to much time. It tasted great - well not great great, but as good as any other "great" shot i have pulled, which actually does not say a lot, but thats another story ;)
Will experiment more with your approch... cant hurt, it can only make me more experienced, either failing or succeeding ;)
Posted Wed Jul 13, 2005, 10:50pm Subject: Re: Timing the cooling flush on E61 machines?
i'm resurrecting this thread (though i could have picked any number of the HX flush ones) because, although i had a pretty good mastery of the e61 HX flush by senses, i recently became frustrated with what i knew was a super-awesome SO bean (the yirg on sale right now at sweet maria's) resulting in shots that were all over the map -- no matter how hard i tried to regulate brew temp with identical flushing routines. it was clear that temp fluctuations -- however minor -- were hindering consistency with a particularly temp-sensitive bean.
so i bought a thermocouple, did "fake" flushes all day long, then videotaped the most reliable flushing routine i know in order to nail a shot in the 199-203-degree range (any HX machine will still fluctuate somehwhat -- the idea was to keep it in the narrowest, most optimal zone possible).
the results -- in the form of a 7MB video -- are at the blog. also listed are the basic steps in text form. this should be of especial help to isomac users and those with similar machines (andrejas, etc.) -- i run a tea with the dual guages and dual lights to indicate the boiler cycle. if you're confused, just watch the video. anyone with an e61 group and heat exchanger should find it helpful, i think. and as i wrote on the blog, this neatly consummates, for me, what has been a series of related home machine issues -- why certain blends and beans are better for the home than others, how well the boiler gauge serves as a temp proxy, how to perform the optimal HX flush, etc.
Symbols: = New Posts since your last visit = No New Posts since last visit = Newest post
Forum Rules: No profanity, illegal acts or personal attacks will be tolerated in these discussion boards. No commercial posting of any nature will be tolerated; only private sales by private individuals, in the "Buy and Sell" forum. No cross posting allowed - do not post your topic to more than one forum, nor repost a topic to the same forum. Who Can Read The Forum? Anyone can read posts in these discussion boards. Who Can Post New Topics? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post new topics. Who Can Post Replies? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post replies. Can Photos be posted? Anyone can post photos in their new topics or replies. Who can change or delete posts? Any CoffeeGeek member can edit their own posts. Only moderators can delete posts. Probationary Period: If you are a new signup for CoffeeGeek, you cannot promote, endorse, criticise or otherwise post an unsolicited endorsement for any company, product or service in your first five postings.
![cannonfodder: shotstart.JPG](javascript:ImagePopup("/images/18941/shotstart.JPG", 342, 246, "cannonfodder: shotstart.JPG");)
= No New Posts since last visit 