Posted Thu Oct 7, 2010, 5:50pm Subject: Re: ECM / Rocket Giotto User Group
carlhpretired Said:
On Page 5 of Dave Corbey's (coffeegeek ID: DavecUK) excellent review of the Evoluzione there is a photo of the internals with everything nicely labeled.
I'd remove the top of the machine and take a look (and listen) around. If you still can't identify the source of the hissing noise, try using a length of plastic tubing as a stethoscope and probe around the insides until you locate the leak. Please let us know when you've solved the mystery.
Wow - Awesome review by Dave - hats off!! Everyone whos interested in this machine or any of Rockets products should read that fully. Great pictures and honest straight forward talk.
I'll keep you updated. Thanks Carl.
"I'm a man of simple tastes, easily satisfied by the best" Winston Churchill
Posted Fri Oct 8, 2010, 6:43am Subject: Re: ECM / Rocket Giotto User Group
So today I was going to lift my machine off its raised counter top location and open it up to find that slight hissing? Well today - its been on for about 3 hours and no hissing? When I first noticed the hissing it was last week thrusday/friday. I went away form the weekend so I shut the machine off. (I have it on a timer to come on at about 6 am and go off at 10 pm) I've come back Tuesday and not heard anything until Wednesday. Both Wednesday and Thursday - hissing. Today; Friday nothing? WTF?! I know its not difficult to open it up but its a slight pain in the ass to lift if down off the raised counter - remove the cups etc unscrew everything - just to take a look?! If its not broke - and I do an excellent daily service / cleaning ritual then all I can do is what for the hissing to start up again?
"I'm a man of simple tastes, easily satisfied by the best" Winston Churchill
Posted Fri Oct 8, 2010, 7:58am Subject: Re: ECM / Rocket Giotto User Group
The issue is almost certainly with the vacuum breaker. It looks like a fitting in the boiler with nothing attached to it, and your case I would guess that it has developed some scale deposits that cause it to hiss intermittantly.
If you want to confirm, go ahead and take the machine down and remove the case. Then plug it in and turn it on (make sure all connections are sound and that there are no electrical wires bare/exposed - also do not touch any electrical connections while the machine is energized)
As it heats up you will hear some hissing from the vacuum breaker until the boiler pressure gets strong enough to close the valve (this is how the valve works to prevent false pressure). If you watch the process you will see the valve sputter just a bit until it seals and then it will go quiet.
Then turn off and unplug the machine and let it cool off before removing the vacuum breaker to disassemble and clean it (or just replace it with a new one, I think they are fairly inexpensive).
The reason these things tend to scale up so quickly is because they get wet and hot so water is evaproated from the seal areas over and over and this tends to leave behind water deposits even if the water is fairly soft. The upside is that this is usually just a fitting that is threaded into the boiler so it's an easy removal and/or replacement operation
Posted Fri Oct 8, 2010, 7:44pm Subject: Re: ECM / Rocket Giotto User Group
vjhardcore Said:
So today I was going to lift my machine off its raised counter top location and open it up to find that slight hissing? Well today - its been on for about 3 hours and no hissing? When I first noticed the hissing it was last week thrusday/friday. I went away form the weekend so I shut the machine off. (I have it on a timer to come on at about 6 am and go off at 10 pm) I've come back Tuesday and not heard anything until Wednesday. Both Wednesday and Thursday - hissing. Today; Friday nothing? WTF?! I know its not difficult to open it up but its a slight pain in the ass to lift if down off the raised counter - remove the cups etc unscrew everything - just to take a look?! If its not broke - and I do an excellent daily service / cleaning ritual then all I can do is what for the hissing to start up again?
Mike, you might also want to checkout this excellent article on the operation of the Pressure Relief Valve (aka Safety Valve). It seems there are certain types of failures of this valve that can cause symtoms similar to what you're currently experiencing with your machine (i.e. hissing noise - constant or intermittent)
DirkVan Senior Member Joined: 2 Jan 2006 Posts: 8 Location: Phoenix,AZ Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Giotto classic (formerly... Grinder: La Cimbali Jr.
Posted Tue Oct 26, 2010, 11:11pm Subject: Re: ECM / Rocket Giotto User Group
Revisiting bookmarks a month or so after acquiring my Giotto classic. I've been geeking out on aspects of this machine, thinking I'd have some critical question to post to this thread, but at this point all I can do is share the enthusiasm. The Giotto is an upgrade from Sylvia, which served my wife and me well for 5 or so years. I got the upgrade bug after checking Craigslist to help a friend look for a Sylvia, and coming across some decent deals on higher level machines. I had one somewhat funny encounter where a wife listed a Ventrano and was willing to sell for $650, but it was a divorce, and she said I would have to contact the husband. Turned out he was not at all interested in selling his Ventrano - especially for $650. Oh well. The Giotto was a true counter queen. Listed as never been used with an asking price of $550. The seller said he thought he'd like to get into espresso, but never got around to it. When I asked where he got the machine, he said he didn't know; the interior decorator got it. Although the serial number indicates 2002, it really did look unused. I turned it on quickly, checked the portafilter, which had no staining, and bought it. Once home, I checked the mushroom for scaling, and it was brand new shiny steel - as shiny as the outside of the E61. Just in case water had been standing in the boiler/hx, I did a thorough descaling and ran a lot of rinse cycles. Also checked the gasket and dispersion screen, which also showed no signs of use. If I hadn't picked it up from a gated community and a house that looked like it was put together by an interior decorator, I might be concerned that it was hot :-) . After a month, the shots are great. The milk-based drinks are great. My biggest concern is troubleshooting/fixing when something eventually breaks. For example, most recently on Sylvia, when I wasn't getting water volume out of the brewhead, it was so easy to google the symptom to find a list of likely causes. I was able to pretty quickly determine that the problem was with the 3-way valve, specifically the solenoid. Then further there are sites with pictures of how to disassemble and how to test the solenoid. I'm hoping that the generic E61 design and seemingly interchangeable parts will make the Giotto not too hard to maintain.
lttlscamp Senior Member Joined: 25 Dec 2009 Posts: 38 Location: Toronto Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: Rocket Giotto Evoluzione Grinder: Baratza Vario
Posted Fri Nov 5, 2010, 3:50pm Subject: Re: ECM / Rocket Giotto User Group
Does anyone have any hints they can give me for steaming smaller quantities of milk? I'm having a really hard time getting any substantial microfoam before the milk heats up too much.
My usual caps are around 6-7 ounces of milk and it only takes about 20 seconds of steaming before it's too hot and I have to stop.
I've tried varying how much I turn on the steam wand but it doesn't make any difference. I've tried with the tip towards the outside of the pitcher, the middle, and sort of between the middle of the outside. Shallow...deep. You name it. I always get a good swirl but most of my foam is always at the top.
I read it mentioned that the boiler pressure is set on the low side for steaming. Mine tops out at around 1.1 bar. Do I really need to up it? Won't that just make the heating problem worse?
Posted Wed Dec 21, 2011, 11:53pm Subject: Re: ECM / Rocket Giotto User Group
I'm about to jump on this boat for a premium plus model and would like to know how has it been for the users of this thread since its been a little bit more than a year. Has anything unusual happened or anything needed replacing?
Posted Thu Dec 22, 2011, 10:28am Subject: Re: ECM / Rocket Giotto User Group
A friend of mine has had a Rocket for over a year and loves it. He's had no problems at all. I've had my machine about 3 months and it's been outstanding. Excellent performance, top quality and great fit and finish.
nixter Senior Member Joined: 29 Jan 2008 Posts: 162 Location: Vancouver Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Giotto Evoluzione, Oscar Pro Grinder: Baratza Vario
Posted Thu Dec 22, 2011, 11:24am Subject: Re: ECM / Rocket Giotto User Group
I've had the Giotto Evo for 1.5 yrs now. It's an extremely well built machine. I don't think there's a better looking HX or single boiler around in this price range. In fact I don't think there's a better looking machine until you get into Elektra money.
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