cactus Senior Member Joined: 27 Feb 2012 Posts: 18 Location: Vancouver Expertise: I like coffee
Posted Fri Mar 16, 2012, 8:30pm Subject: Re: Looking to purchase Silvia V3 and Virtuoso Preciso Grinder.
Rbrac Said:
Its good to hear that someone else is experiencing what I am. Its sounds like you are a few steps ahead of me. So my obvious question would be; which HX machine would you buy today? Can you send me a link to the e61 HX machine you are looking at as well? The one thing I fear the most is buyers' remorse, and then having this large appliance on my kitchen counter with my wife standing next to it wearing a dirty look. In the end I just want to buy a setup that's right for me, at a price I'm comfortable with. So far, the responses and recommendations have been very helpful and I have plenty to read.
hope it's not too late to jump into the discussion. I was looking at the Oscar at first, but then moved to the Quickmills. Now, I have my eyes set on the Rocket Cellini premium plus together with a Compak K3 grinder. Total cost around 2400 with tax. I may look further at the Giotto or even the Evoluzione model, but for now, it's the Cellini. I too am afraid of buyers remorse, and having to stare at it day in day out. I had a real bad case of buyers remorse when I bought my Suzuki Bandit 600 motorcycle. I rode it probably 5 or 6 times a year and paid dearly in insurance every year. Now, I just stare at it and drive my car instead. I ended up with buyers remorse the second time around with an Omega Seamaster wristwatch. I wear my Citizen Eco drive more. I stopped short of buying a Samsung LED smart TV last year. I didn't want to make it a perfect trifecta of misery.
I don't want to dissuade you from buying what you really want. These are my examples and not necessarily yours. That's why I haven't bought mine yet.
Madurodave Senior Member Joined: 3 Feb 2012 Posts: 141 Location: NH Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Rancilio Silvia Grinder: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso Vac Pot: Yama 5 cup Drip: Mr Coffee, perculator Roaster: HotTop B, West Bend Air...
Posted Fri Mar 16, 2012, 9:07pm Subject: Re: Looking to purchase Silvia V3 and Virtuoso Preciso Grinder.
cactus Said:
hope it's not too late to jump into the discussion. I was looking at the Oscar at first, but then moved to the Quickmills. Now, I have my eyes set on the Rocket Cellini premium plus together with a Compak K3 grinder. Total cost around 2400 with tax. I may look further at the Giotto or even the Evoluzione model, but for now, it's the Cellini. I too am afraid of buyers remorse, and having to stare at it day in day out. I had a real bad case of buyers remorse when I bought my Suzuki Bandit 600 motorcycle. I rode it probably 5 or 6 times a year and paid dearly in insurance every year. Now, I just stare at it and drive my car instead. I ended up with buyers remorse the second time around with an Omega Seamaster wristwatch. I wear my Citizen Eco drive more. I stopped short of buying a Samsung LED smart TV last year. I didn't want to make it a perfect trifecta of misery.
I don't want to dissuade you from buying what you really want. These are my examples and not necessarily yours. That's why I haven't bought mine yet.
My words of wisdom from my good and bad purchase experiences: If something costs a few hundred or more, give it some real thought. Do you really NEED it? If you don't get it, will it make your life worse? I try now to get thongs that will enhance my life and that I will really use. I ride motorcycles too and did a lot of soul searching as to what to get. Ended up with a Harley Road King Classic. Expensive, but I love riding it every minute. I thought I wanted a faster sportbike, but decided a nice touring bike fit me more in this stage of my life. I did buy a LED tv (Samung too) but returned it and bought a less expensive Sony LCD tv. Bigger cabinet, but I think it has as nice or perhaps a nicer picture. You don't have to buy "the best". Sometimes the best is not really the best, just a status symbol for the moment. I bought my wife a very nice watch 3 years ago and got myself a Citizen Eco Drive watch for 10% of the price of hers. Hers did not keep time as well so she returned it. My "cheap" watch was better even though hers had more status!
Anyway, just put thought into what you want. I did the same with my espresso maker. Started thinking about a super automatic, recommendations on this and other boards was to get a very expensive espresso maker and grinder. I bought a Silvia and Preciso grinder. It works for me and my situation perfectly. The money I saved I now used for a Hottop roaster! I won't say the recommendations were wrong, just wrong for me and my personal needs. I struggled with the decision for a while but could not be happier with my choices!
Dave Harley rider, Espresso drinker, Primo XL grill
ocarolina Senior Member Joined: 30 Apr 2007 Posts: 59 Location: chicago suburbs Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Rancilio silvia 3 Grinder: baratza preciso Drip: french press - no drip Roaster: behmor / iroast2
Posted Sat Mar 17, 2012, 5:35am Subject: Re: Looking to purchase Silvia V3 and Virtuoso Preciso Grinder.
I LOVE my Behmor roaster. I know many people have problems with the preset profiles, but I roast mainly beans for espresso, so I always do 1/2 lb at a time, and use the 1 lb settings. Right when second crack starts, I cool down. I know that there are so many more people here that are way better at everything coffee than me, but I am pleasantly content with my setup of the Behmor, Baratza grinder, and Silvia. I am loving that I can actually drink straight espresso now. Although I am no expert on all the fine tunings of coffee, I am happy and fortunate to own these machines. Maybe down the line I may choose a higher priced setup (my hubby would not know the difference in the coffee tastes anyway), but for now, I am blissfully happy in my coffee. Thanks for agreeing with me too.
Madurodave Senior Member Joined: 3 Feb 2012 Posts: 141 Location: NH Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Rancilio Silvia Grinder: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso Vac Pot: Yama 5 cup Drip: Mr Coffee, perculator Roaster: HotTop B, West Bend Air...
Posted Sat Mar 17, 2012, 8:31am Subject: Re: Looking to purchase Silvia V3 and Virtuoso Preciso Grinder.
ocarolina Said:
I LOVE my Behmor roaster. I know many people have problems with the preset profiles, but I roast mainly beans for espresso, so I always do 1/2 lb at a time, and use the 1 lb settings. Right when second crack starts, I cool down. I know that there are so many more people here that are way better at everything coffee than me, but I am pleasantly content with my setup of the Behmor, Baratza grinder, and Silvia. I am loving that I can actually drink straight espresso now. Although I am no expert on all the fine tunings of coffee, I am happy and fortunate to own these machines. Maybe down the line I may choose a higher priced setup (my hubby would not know the difference in the coffee tastes anyway), but for now, I am blissfully happy in my coffee. Thanks for agreeing with me too.
Like I said, everyone has to get what works for them. If I was making many milk drinks in the morning or entertained a lot, I probably would have gone with something different. For my use, the Silvia is perfect. Can't wait to roast on my Hottop!
Dave Harley rider, Espresso drinker, Primo XL grill
Rbrac Senior Member Joined: 2 Mar 2012 Posts: 14 Location: Niagara Ontario Expertise: Just starting
Posted Sun Mar 18, 2012, 5:07pm Subject: Re: Looking to purchase Silvia V3 and Virtuoso Preciso Grinder.
I made the trip to a local vendor this weekend and spent considerable time with one of the owners discussing my options. The gentlemen was well informed on the intricacies of the various machines on the market. Any of the machines I would be interested in purchasing were on display and ready to pull a shot if I wished. In the end, we 'plan' to purchase the Bezzera BZ07 with the Preciso grinder. This combination will definitely put me over my original budget of $1400.00, but the vendor has offered to make us a package deal that should make the purchase more palatable. Unfortunately my budget isn't as high as yours. And as for the TV, I actually have a Samsung LED, purchased last year, hooked up to an HD receiver. The picture is excellent, but will never match that of a plasma. Its especially noticeable in action movies or sporting events. Thanks. Rob.
Madurodave Senior Member Joined: 3 Feb 2012 Posts: 141 Location: NH Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Rancilio Silvia Grinder: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso Vac Pot: Yama 5 cup Drip: Mr Coffee, perculator Roaster: HotTop B, West Bend Air...
Posted Sun Mar 18, 2012, 5:15pm Subject: Re: Looking to purchase Silvia V3 and Virtuoso Preciso Grinder.
Rbrac Said:
I made the trip to a local vendor this weekend and spent considerable time with one of the owners discussing my options. The gentlemen was well informed on the intricacies of the various machines on the market. Any of the machines I would be interested in purchasing were on display and ready to pull a shot if I wished. In the end, we 'plan' to purchase the Bezzera BZ07 with the Preciso grinder. This combination will definitely put me over my original budget of $1400.00, but the vendor has offered to make us a package deal that should make the purchase more palatable. Unfortunately my budget isn't as high as yours. And as for the TV, I actually have a Samsung LED, purchased last year, hooked up to an HD receiver. The picture is excellent, but will never match that of a plasma. Its especially noticeable in action movies or sporting events. Thanks. Rob.
Sounds like a great espresso machine and grinder combo! Congrats! As far as my budget, you will probably spend the same as I did for my Silvia/Preciso package and roaster combined! But as I have stated, the Silvia works for my needs. Since you need more shots and milk drinks you are making a wise choice. I would recommend you try some shots at the vendor just to make sure everything about the machine is clear for your home use. It never hurts to get some hands-on and some practice!
I like plasma too, except the picture is a little too dark for the lighting in my house. I went with and LCD as I mentioned, which works great in my lighting situation.
Dave Harley rider, Espresso drinker, Primo XL grill
mhborstad Senior Member Joined: 18 Feb 2012 Posts: 31 Location: Gatineau Expertise: I like coffee
Posted Sun Mar 18, 2012, 5:43pm Subject: Re: Looking to purchase Silvia V3 and Virtuoso Preciso Grinder.
Rbrac Said:
I made the trip to a local vendor this weekend and spent considerable time with one of the owners discussing my options. The gentlemen was well informed on the intricacies of the various machines on the market. Any of the machines I would be interested in purchasing were on display and ready to pull a shot if I wished. In the end, we 'plan' to purchase the Bezzera BZ07 with the Preciso grinder.
Sounds like a great way to make the decision! So many reviews and comments online are rooted in self-justifying an already-made purchase that it's hard to know what to think. Recipe for analysis paralysis.
Totally ignoring above comment... :-D What helped "make" your choice after seeing the options?
Madurodave Senior Member Joined: 3 Feb 2012 Posts: 141 Location: NH Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Rancilio Silvia Grinder: Baratza Virtuoso Preciso Vac Pot: Yama 5 cup Drip: Mr Coffee, perculator Roaster: HotTop B, West Bend Air...
Posted Mon Mar 19, 2012, 2:59am Subject: Re: Looking to purchase Silvia V3 and Virtuoso Preciso Grinder.
mhborstad Said:
Sounds like a great way to make the decision! So many reviews and comments online are rooted in self-justifying an already-made purchase that it's hard to know what to think. Recipe for analysis paralysis.
Tell me about it! I was almost ready to throw in the towel after the reviews and comments received. It's almost like "you're not worthy to step into the espresso ring"! I felt like I should toss in the towel and give up.
Dave Harley rider, Espresso drinker, Primo XL grill
JasonBrandtLewis Senior Member Joined: 9 Dec 2005 Posts: 6,099 Location: Berkeley, CA Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Elektra T1 - La Valentina -... Grinder: Mahlkönig K30 Vario -... Vac Pot: Yama 5-cup Drip: CCD, Chemex Roaster: No, no, not another...
Posted Mon Mar 19, 2012, 7:10am Subject: Re: Looking to purchase Silvia V3 and Virtuoso Preciso Grinder.
mhborstad Said:
So many reviews and comments online are rooted in self-justifying an already-made purchase that it's hard to know what to think. Recipe for analysis paralysis.
Agreed, which is why one goes for weight . . . the number of people recommending a particular machine/grinder . . . also, there are (at least for me) certain individuals on this site I've come to trust more than others due to a combination of past experience with their recommendations and the time they've been around.
It's impossible for most of us to go to a "showroom" and, "hands-on," try out any number of machines and/or grinders. Very few of us live within convenient driving distance of 1st-Line, Chris' Coffee Service, idrinkcoffee, and others. Our only option is going to a department store like Macy's or a store like Sur La Table or Williams-Sonoma, and that means a) consumer appliances, rather than "prosumer" or professional equipment; and b) more often than not, selections limited to Breville and Nespresso, rather than Bezzera, Quick Mill, Vibiemme, or Elektra (among many, many others). Ergo, most of us must rely on suggestions from others, and -- in the end -- take a leap of faith.
I only suffered one mis-step this way (i.e.: buying the "wrong" machine), and the vender did take my machine back and refund my money. Every other machine and/or grinder I've purchased online has been exactly as I had hoped. was exactly what I wanted . . .
Posted Mon Mar 19, 2012, 8:17am Subject: Re: Looking to purchase Silvia V3 and Virtuoso Preciso Grinder.
JasonBrandtLewis Said:
It's impossible for most of us to go to a "showroom" and, "hands-on," try out any number of machines and/or grinders. ... most of us must rely on suggestions from others, and -- in the end -- take a leap of faith.
Similar discussions pop up on a regular basis, and revolve around, how can anyone, just starting out, be convinced that spending $800-2000 on a grinder is a good idea. Or why a $2500 espresso machine is worth every cent. It can't be done, I think.
Distilled down, the advice I would give is: Start out spending relatively as little as possible on the espresso machine and get a good, mid-range espresso grinder. That is usually one of the Gaggias paried with a Baratza grinder. Work that for a year or two. If at that time you like what is going on, and feel like you will have a long-term relationship with espresso, then drop the big bucks on top line pro-sumer gear.
I can go on and on about the difference between my first outfit (Silvia+Rocky+Hea=rthware Precision roaster) to what I now have (VBM+Mazzer Kony+Hottop) and the benefit of the better equipment, but someone just starting out is not going to be able to comprehend the logic in spending $1500 to get a machine that "only" grinds coffee.
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