fabchef Senior Member Joined: 27 Feb 2007 Posts: 64 Location: mtl Expertise: I love coffee
Posted Sat Apr 28, 2012, 10:05am Subject: Re: 3 way solenoid..is it really a "must-have"???
I agree, for 300.00 you don't get much around here...at that price you might be able to get a basic saeco machine in ABS plasic. I know that many people out there have these older (non-3 way) machines and i' sure they still work okay. I know that on my old gaggia "espresso" once the shot was done, if i opened it right away(slowly) it wouldn't sneeze but the coffee inside was wet, no biggie. If i left the machine on for some time with coffee in the PF and would go to open it, then the coffee inside would be dryer but would sneeze. The one i saw for sale used is the older "coffee model like this one in the review section: http://coffeegeek.com/reviews/consumer/gaggia_coffee By most of the reviews, is seems like a good solid machine...at around $200.00, you think it's a good deal? Was thinking of combining this with a new rancilio rocky, anyone have this combo? do they work well together? does the rocky dial in well with the gaggia? thanks fabs
I've heard this and it never made sense to me. This will only release the pressure in the boiler and on the boiler wide of the brewing line. There will little if any pressure built up in the boiler. Ther pressure is between the two way valve and the PF.
coffee_no_sugar Said:
Anyways I never found the 3-way value to be a must have. Temperature stability is more important as I refuse to temp surf. I also really like 10+ oz boilers in order to provide hot water for americanos, tea and hot chocolate
Agreed, like I said, a three way solenoid won't do anything for your espresso, it's merely convenience. But I'm also with Mario on this; a temp stable machine with 10 oz boiler will have a 3way. Any sbdu machine that's not PID controlled will need temp surfing, just nature of the beast.
I've never had a 3-way valve on a machine at home, and while I've certainly fallen prey to the dreaded Portafilter Sneeze a few times, I've never found that brewing shots back to back was all that difficult. My approach is to loosen the portafilter after the shot just enough that I can tilt it and release the pressure. This is sometimes accompanied by a bit of water, maybe some grounds, but for the most part, it's 5-10 seconds of steam and hot air blowing out before you can remove the pf and proceed as normal. That may be too much effort for some, I suppose, but it's hardly a chore.
Just preference speaking here, to me I consider it a chore. You adapt to whatever your procedure is, but once you don't have the messy pucks, you won't want to go back.
fabchef Said:
Was thinking of combining this with a new rancilio rocky, anyone have this combo? do they work well together? does the rocky dial in well with the gaggia? thanks fabs
Honestly, (IMHO) the rocky doesnt dial in with any machine. No, it's a decent grinder, but the steps are too large. It just limits your ability to dial in the coffee. I've had stepped and stepless grinders and stepless is the way to go. I would personally look at a baratza Vario. Yes it's stepped, but it's on a micro scale that it acts nearly as stepless. The Preciso i think produces a great shot too, less expensive but not as user friendly for espresso.
Outside of that you could look used, for a commercial grinder if you have the room.
Just because the Silvia needs a PID, don't generalize that to all the SBDUs. The SBDU in my kitchen has a heavy group and a capillary termostat. Several SBDUs have electronic controls that are not PIDs. There are even old lever machines that can produce great shots and some didn't even have thermostats or pressurestats.
My taste buds may not be that sensitive but I tested a Rancillio Audrey (Silvia in a retro case), and I found it had an inconsistent temperature. Went to the basement in short order as I have better machines to use.
fabchef Senior Member Joined: 27 Feb 2007 Posts: 64 Location: mtl Expertise: I love coffee
Posted Sat Apr 28, 2012, 5:05pm Subject: Re: 3 way solenoid..is it really a "must-have"???
Joel ,thanks for the replies. I will look into the baratza as well...as the store that i was at also offers it. I too heard about the rocky sometimes being too large in steps. As for commercial, i actually do have a commercial (older) rossi grinder. the thing is that it's quite tall with the hopper and it runs on a 220V. for home use it's not very convenient, as i have to use a power transformer to make it work. I know for a home it might be over-kill but it would be cool to use...if it was a bit smaller. fab
Joel_B Senior Member Joined: 9 Oct 2007 Posts: 1,823 Location: Pacific NW Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Astra Mega II Grinder: Mazzer SJ, Virtuoso Vac Pot: Yama 5 cup Drip: nope, french press Roaster: Behmor, WP, BBQ drum
Posted Sun Apr 29, 2012, 9:55am Subject: Re: 3 way solenoid..is it really a "must-have"???
coffee_no_sugar Said:
Just because the Silvia needs a PID, don't generalize that to all the SBDUs. The SBDU in my kitchen has a heavy group and a capillary termostat. Several SBDUs have electronic controls that are not PIDs. There are even old lever machines that can produce great shots and some didn't even have thermostats or pressurestats.
You may have mis understood my comment? PID or not, temp surf or not, most machines can create good shots. I shouldn't have limited temp stability to PID, correct. But without someway of keeping the brewing water temo stable, temp management is needed on the barista side if the process. I admittedly don't know a lot about them, but don't capillary thermostats still have a deadband?
fabchef Senior Member Joined: 27 Feb 2007 Posts: 64 Location: mtl Expertise: I love coffee
Posted Sun Apr 29, 2012, 12:16pm Subject: Re: 3 way solenoid..is it really a "must-have"???
hi guys, just wondering, do most of the semi-automatic (like my magic combi) have a 3 way solenoid? I know that when i open the handle on mine, i hear a hissing noise but never get the "sneeze" effect, and the coffee inside is a little on the wet side. There is no external drain tube (like the newer gaggia classics do)..so i'm guessing that there is no 3 way vavle. If the other (non 3 way) gaggia machines work the same way, i don't have an issue with this. It's also rare that i would have to make a bunch of espresso's back-to-back..at the most 4 espresso's maybe once or twice a week...let me know whatcha think. oh ya, in the slightly older gaggia "coffee" machines (regular or deluxe model)..is the casing in metal or plastic? thanks fabs
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