CMIN Senior Member Joined: 14 Jun 2012 Posts: 501 Location: South FL Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: Crossland CC1 Grinder: Baratza Preciso
Posted Thu Jun 14, 2012, 4:02pm Subject: Having trouble with Bar32 shots and Hario Mini
Using a Hario Mini, no problem with shots with Starbucks beans, even had them grind at the store half (shudder lol) to test and still worked fine for a few days before you could tell a difference in staleness taste. However been trying some fresh orders, Red Bird, Intelligensia etc and whether pressurized basket or de-pressurized, either the shots are water and not a hint of crema or choke the machine no matter what tamp adjustment I make or grind setting or temp surfing. Tried 2-5 on the Hario. I've seen people on here say they've used the Hario at setting 2-3 no problem on a EC155 (which is basically the same) and other similar units. Going through beans and $ like crazy testing, and the only things that work are the Starbucks beans go figure.
Not sure what the issue is, I can keep trying a higher grind setting but you can tell that's getting too coarse and from what I read 2 is the general setting for espresso on the Hario Mini with 1 being for turkish, no problem with the grinder is it def grinds as fine as a Preciso I had. Sold it and thought we'd upgrade machines sooner but doing a few other things before dropping some nice change, so grabbed the Hario Mini for right now.
fwtechwiz Senior Member Joined: 19 Feb 2010 Posts: 522 Location: Fort Wayne, IN Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Gaggia Evolution Grinder: Hario Skerton
Posted Thu Jun 14, 2012, 4:32pm Subject: Re: Having trouble with Bar32 shots and Hario Mini
I've seen references on Roaste.com about the mini mill. It has the same inherent problems with design as it's bigger brother, the Skerton. Too much play between the metal shaft on the moving burr and it's housing, causing an inconsistant grind. Here's a link to a mod suggested by them which will stabilize the shaft and greatly improve the consistancy. Roaste
CMIN Senior Member Joined: 14 Jun 2012 Posts: 501 Location: South FL Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: Crossland CC1 Grinder: Baratza Preciso
Posted Thu Jun 14, 2012, 4:52pm Subject: Re: Having trouble with Bar32 shots and Hario Mini
fwtechwiz Said:
I've seen references on Roaste.com about the mini mill. It has the same inherent problems with design as it's bigger brother, the Skerton. Too much play between the metal shaft on the moving burr and it's housing, causing an inconsistant grind. Here's a link to a mod suggested by them which will stabilize the shaft and greatly improve the consistancy. Roaste
Had already seen that and done the mod lol, didn't seem to make a big difference. Still grinded as fine as my Preciso w/o the mod.
Just tried on click 5 and the shot came out better this time, at least than before, didn't choke the machine and had crema but it tasted extremely sour (Intelligensia Black Cat). Very odd to me that the Starbucks beans are tasting better than the $$$ ones I'm buying right now fresh roasted, I doubt the couple bag's I've gotten from roasters are all bad somehow lol???
I don't know how others are using this grinder at click 2-3 no problem, as it chokes the machine easily.
fwtechwiz Senior Member Joined: 19 Feb 2010 Posts: 522 Location: Fort Wayne, IN Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Gaggia Evolution Grinder: Hario Skerton
Posted Thu Jun 14, 2012, 5:45pm Subject: Re: Having trouble with Bar32 shots and Hario Mini
I would suggest getting back to basics. First, how many grams are you using? Rule of thumb states if the shot is sour, you are under extracting, either from too cold brew water or too little coffee in the dose, or too coarse a grind. If your grind is ok then either brew hotter, or dose more. Not a clue why the starbuck's beans are tasting and brewing better...are you using the same amount in grams of the starbucks as you do the others?
EDIT: BTW I have pulled Black Cat and I do remember having to really pack the basket with 19 grams to get past the sour taste. Actually pulled better using the triple basket, but still grinding and pulling for a double. IMHO a lot of coffee wasted. For that reason I've not tried Black Cat again.
ggcadc Senior Member Joined: 25 Mar 2008 Posts: 146 Location: San Diego, CA Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: QM Alexia Grinder: Mazzer mini E, Virtuoso,... Vac Pot: Yama 3 cup Drip: All of them Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Thu Jun 14, 2012, 10:36pm Subject: Re: Having trouble with Bar32 shots and Hario Mini
im not sure what you should expect out of that machine, i dont think the grinder is the issue. This sounds typical of a machine running at high pressure, the gaggias do it before they are dialed down from POD magic mode to regular 9bar espresso.
CMIN Senior Member Joined: 14 Jun 2012 Posts: 501 Location: South FL Expertise: I like coffee
Espresso: Crossland CC1 Grinder: Baratza Preciso
Posted Fri Jun 15, 2012, 8:46am Subject: Re: Having trouble with Bar32 shots and Hario Mini
No idea what the pressure is don't have a reader for it, but saw a post where someone hacked the EC155 (same internals) to measure and saw 7-8 bars on a double. Usually somewhere right around 18g for the double basket, don't have the single as it got mangled in the trash disposal lol. I know it won't make the "best" shot or coffee, but I do know this machine and the EC155 can make pretty damn decent shots, I'm doing it no problem with friggen Starbucks beans tasting better and less bitter/sour lol, it's all the fresh roasted coffee I've been buying that's giving me fitz even Red Bird.
Though from what I'm reading I'm seeing a lot of reviews and post online about Black Cat being pretty mehhhhh for espresso, lot's of people calling it sour and bitter even at right temps. Odd as I read some good reviews on. I know a buddy told me he didn't care for it either and he has the Vario-W and Breville Dual Boiler (which i'm thinking of getting next).
I know these smaller machine have less efficient boilers, think I'm going to try heating up the water to hot temps in the microwave then pour into the tank so that way when running a shot or recovery time, won't have large temp differences especially dropping from the boiler pulling in room temp water from the tank.
Posted Fri Jun 15, 2012, 8:32pm Subject: Re: Having trouble with Bar32 shots and Hario Mini
CMIN Said:
I know these smaller machine have less efficient boilers, think I'm going to try heating up the water to hot temps in the microwave then pour into the tank so that way when running a shot or recovery time, won't have large temp differences especially dropping from the boiler pulling in room temp water from the tank.
Think I just found that out lol. Shortly after the steam wand works perfect still, but there was barely any water coming out of the group head, there is now but even with a light tamp it gets choked up too easily. However this was happening before with fresh beans except for starbucks whole beans. I checked it again today and even with stale SB beans it made a shot, tried with Red Bird... no go.
I'm just going to upgrade and take this machine apart and figure out what's going on as like to keep it as a backup up or maybe put in an office as it is a cool looking little machine.
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