Our Valued Sponsor
OpinionsConsumer ReviewsGuides and How TosCoffeeGeek ReviewsResourcesForums
Espresso: Espresso Machines
Bialetti size taste difference
Rocket R58 Double Boiler
Rocket Espresso R58 Double Boiler -  Everything you need for the perfect shot!
www.seattlecoffeegear.com
 
Not Logged in: Log In to Postlog in
New Topics updated topics   New Posts new posts   Unanswered Posts new unanswered  
Search Discussion Board search   Discussion Board FAQ faq   Signup sign up  
Discussions > Espresso > Machines > Bialetti size...  
view previous topic | view next topic | view all topics
Author Messages
badmajon
Senior Member


Joined: 26 Apr 2012
Posts: 17
Location: Pasadena, CA
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Sun Aug 26, 2012, 4:50am
Subject: Bialetti size taste difference
 

Hello, I started using a bialetti 3 cup mokka pot when I was away on business, and now that I'm living back home again I bought a 12 cup version in order to make enough to share. This morning, my wife slept in, so I dusted off the old 3 cup version since I was only making one for myself, and wow, the coffee tasted good!

Later, my wife woke up and I made a batch in the 12 cup model. Wow, inferior coffee. Why is this? My best coffee memories come from the small pot- coffee brewed in the 12 cup model just tastes thin and not nearly as flavorful.

My questions are 1) why is there a taste difference and 2) can I get the same 3 cup flavor in my 12 cup?
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
badmajon
Senior Member


Joined: 26 Apr 2012
Posts: 17
Location: Pasadena, CA
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Sun Aug 26, 2012, 3:13pm
Subject: Re: Bialetti size taste difference
 

Nobody? Even wild theories...?
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
Coffeenoobie
Senior Member
Coffeenoobie
Joined: 11 Dec 2011
Posts: 3,030
Location: PNW
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: N S Oscar
Grinder: K30 & Vario W
Posted Sun Aug 26, 2012, 3:52pm
Subject: Re: Bialetti size taste difference
 

My Wild A$$ Guess is amount of pressure is greater in the small one than the large one.  Assuming you have the coffee to water ratio right.

 
Coffeenoobie

Buying advice: GRINDER GRINDER GRINDER. Don't cheap out on the grinder.

My coffee treasure map...
Click Here (maps.google.com)

Oscar trick out: http://s156.photobucket.com/user/GandBteam/story/14231
back to top
 View Profile Visit website Link to this post
__________
Senior Member


Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 905
Location: .
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Machine now fixed ;o)
Grinder: None
Vac Pot: None
Drip: None
Roaster: None
Posted Sun Aug 26, 2012, 3:53pm
Subject: Re: Bialetti size taste difference
 

Nothing definite I'm afraid.  I've always viewed stovetop coffee as being a bit of a folk art, and not lending itself easily to a precise and refined process. That is all part of its charm I think.

Having said that, although I don't have bialetti devices, I do have several stovetop brewers of various sizes.  What is obvious is that the ratio of coffee to water differs depending on which one you use, and in the main it differs based on their relative sizes.  

The coffee "puck" is deeper in the larger devices, and the smaller brewers also tend to go through the process more quickly than the larger ones both of which must have some impact on the extraction.

I wouldn't normally drink stovetop coffee black, but it does make good hefty coffee for café au lait even if not being strictly the way it should be done.
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
russel
Senior Member
russel
Joined: 12 Mar 2010
Posts: 448
Location: Los Angeles
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Conti Princess 2grp, GS/3...
Grinder: Super Caimanos x2, Forte BG,...
Drip: V60, Kalita Wave, Clever,...
Posted Sun Aug 26, 2012, 8:48pm
Subject: Re: Bialetti size taste difference
 

Years ago stove top was all that I used.  I have 6 or 7 of them in different sizes.  I too have found that the smallest ones make the best coffee.  I pre heat the water to just under boiling, and use some to pre warm the lower half before assembling them and putting them on the stove.  My theory is that the ratio of metal to water is higher in the smaller pots, meaning that the smaller pots heat up less by the time the brew is done.  I have some non-bialetti pots that are much heavier and use a lot more aluminum in their build.  I find the coffee from the smallest of these to be the best.

I guess I should weigh each pot and see what those ratios actually are...
back to top
 View Profile Visit website Link to this post
badmajon
Senior Member


Joined: 26 Apr 2012
Posts: 17
Location: Pasadena, CA
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Mon Aug 27, 2012, 4:53am
Subject: Re: Bialetti size taste difference
 

I did a side-by-side taste test this morning, and it's confirmed.

The Bialetti 12 cup makes crappy coffee.

It's really just not that good. The coffee made with the 12 cup bialetti moka express has very little body, and varetial notes are nearly impossible to discern. Meanwhile, the coffee brewed in the 3 cup version was absolutely wonderful.

My grinder is probably the weakest link in my production chain, but I could still easily taste the subtal varietal notes in the 3 cup version and the coffee had way more body.

So I guess it's back to the drawing board on how to make a good large pot of coffee for my wife and I to share. Chemex maybe? Neither of us are big on drip coffee or french press. Well, the search goes on. Of course the best solution is a $1000 dollar espresso machine, but that's too expensive for us now.
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
Coffeenoobie
Senior Member
Coffeenoobie
Joined: 11 Dec 2011
Posts: 3,030
Location: PNW
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: N S Oscar
Grinder: K30 & Vario W
Posted Mon Aug 27, 2012, 10:41am
Subject: Re: Bialetti size taste difference
 

Craigslist is your friend and you live in a place that you should see lots of used machines for sale.

 
Coffeenoobie

Buying advice: GRINDER GRINDER GRINDER. Don't cheap out on the grinder.

My coffee treasure map...
Click Here (maps.google.com)

Oscar trick out: http://s156.photobucket.com/user/GandBteam/story/14231
back to top
 View Profile Visit website Link to this post
russel
Senior Member
russel
Joined: 12 Mar 2010
Posts: 448
Location: Los Angeles
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Conti Princess 2grp, GS/3...
Grinder: Super Caimanos x2, Forte BG,...
Drip: V60, Kalita Wave, Clever,...
Posted Mon Aug 27, 2012, 2:05pm
Subject: Re: Bialetti size taste difference
 

For good coffee on a Bialetti budget, I would suggest an aero press, or to make it easier to make multiple cups, two clever coffee drippers.  The aero press will get you the "strong" cup your familiar with, but it's more technique driven and not the best thing to be doing in a rush while sleepy and un-caffeinated.  For $50 you could get two clevers, a scale, a timer, and some filters and you would have all the equipment (other than a good grinder) you would need to make a two large cups of very good coffee.  Spend what you would have spent moving to espresso making on some nice coffee subscriptions and all you would have left to do is to develop the palate and skills needed to get the best flavor in you cup.  I know it's not espresso, but neither is a Moka pot, not by a long shot.  Capable espresso equipment is expensive, period.  Just making your self a really good cup of coffee in the morning doesn't have to be.

Then again, you might consider buying another 3 cup moka pot and just making two at a time...nothing wrong with that.

Out of curiosity, how do you think about your Moka pot coffee?  Is it espresso? Espresso-like?  Strong brew?  The last coffee I had from a Moka pot was terrible (and well over a year ago), but it was being made as if it was some sort of psudo-cappuchino, so it was doomed from the start.
back to top
 View Profile Visit website Link to this post
frcn
Senior Member
frcn
Joined: 23 Dec 2001
Posts: 3,408
Location: Northern California
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Vibiemme Domobar Double
Grinder: Mazzer Kony, Baratza...
Vac Pot: Hario, 2 Cory pots, 1 Cory...
Drip: Behmor Brazen, Bunn A10 mod...
Roaster: computer controlled Hottop,...
Posted Mon Aug 27, 2012, 9:01pm
Subject: Re: Bialetti size taste difference
 

An affordable device that makes a rich, full-bodied brew, and enough for two? The new, larger Espro press (mine is on the way). The body of French press without the bitterness of the sludge. I prefer its mouthfeel and rich flavor over the Aeropress (when used with the paper filters). I have the smaller Espro Press (review on my website) and it is my #1 preferred brew method (and #1 recommended) after espresso.

 
Visit My Website
www.EspressoMyEspresso.com
back to top
 View Profile Visit website Link to this post
badmajon
Senior Member


Joined: 26 Apr 2012
Posts: 17
Location: Pasadena, CA
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Wed Sep 26, 2012, 6:47am
Subject: Re: Bialetti size taste difference
 

Hey everyone. I ended up preordering the Behemor Brazen, so I'm currently waiting for that, but I have figured out how to make better coffee with the 12 cup bialetti. It's not as good as the 3 cup version, but its in the same ballpark if its done right.

I fill the resevoir only to about an inch below the water mark. Then, I fill the coffee 'basket' with coffee, assemble, then put it on the burner on 'high' for 2 minutes. Then I turn it down to medium. I then wait for the coffee to start percolating. I then control the heat so it only trickles out (taking about a minute to complete). Once it starts frothing/bubbling and the water level gets really low in the resevoir, I take it off the heat.

Then I top the brew off with hot water.

I think the problem has something to do with under extraction in the beginning and tannin extraction at the end. Moving the water slowly through the coffee but avoiding the bubbly stuff at the end improves the flavor immensely. Doing this takes a lot of skill too, my coffee quality varies day by day! Some days I get it just right, some days not so much. I guess in the end, it's not the best way of doing things.

I can't wait for that brazen brewer!

Oh and russel, I love the coffee that comes out of my 3 cup mokka pot. I actually brew with both in the morning, I drink the 3 cup's produce, and my wife and I split the 12 cup's. A drum roaster, a brataza grinder, and a 3 cup mokka pot = coffee heaven.
back to top
 View Profile Link to this post
view previous topic | view next topic | view all topics
Discussions > Espresso > Machines > Bialetti size...  
New Topics updated topics   New Posts new posts   Unanswered Posts new unanswered     Search Discussion Board search   Discussion Board FAQ faq   Signup sign up  
Not Logged in: Log In to Postlog in
Discussions Quick Jump:
Symbols: New Posts= New Posts since your last visit      No New Posts= No New Posts since last visit     Go to most recent post= Newest post
Forum Rules:
No profanity, illegal acts or personal attacks will be tolerated in these discussion boards.
No commercial posting of any nature will be tolerated; only private sales by private individuals, in the "Buy and Sell" forum.
No SEO style postings will be tolerated. SEO related posts will result in immediate ban from CoffeeGeek.
No cross posting allowed - do not post your topic to more than one forum, nor repost a topic to the same forum.
Who Can Read The Forum? Anyone can read posts in these discussion boards.
Who Can Post New Topics? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post new topics.
Who Can Post Replies? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post replies.
Can Photos be posted? Anyone can post photos in their new topics or replies.
Who can change or delete posts? Any CoffeeGeek member can edit their own posts. Only moderators can delete posts.
Probationary Period: If you are a new signup for CoffeeGeek, you cannot promote, endorse, criticise or otherwise post an unsolicited endorsement for any company, product or service in your first five postings.
Cafe Solutions
Commercial sales and service, nationwide installation, equipment leasing options.
www.seattlecoffeegear.com
Home | Opinions | Consumer Reviews | Guides & How Tos | CoffeeGeek Reviews | Resources | Forums | Contact Us
CoffeeGeek.com, CoffeeGeek, and Coffee Geek, along with all associated content & images are copyright ©2000-2014 by Mark Prince, all rights reserved, unless otherwise indicated. Content, code, and images may not be reused without permission. Usage of this website signifies agreement with our Terms and Conditions. (0.413853168488)
Privacy Policy | Copyright Info | Terms and Conditions | CoffeeGeek Advertisers | RSS | Find us on Google+