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Rocket R58 Dual Boiler Machine Information and Picture
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369
Senior Member


Joined: 26 Nov 2012
Posts: 3
Location: Australia
Expertise: I like coffee

Posted Wed Nov 28, 2012, 6:08am
Subject: Re: Rocket R58 Dual Boiler Machine Information and Picture
 

Thanks all for the response. I'm definitely keen on an R58!

What you notice with the R58 owners are although the machine may have 1 or 2 minor issues, the overall performance of the R58 whether we are talking about functionality or aesthetics outweigh the minor issues. Each to their own I guess.. especially on these highly involved and expensive little machines.

My other question is.. out of the dozen or so Rocket accessories such as tamps and espresso cups, which accessory have you discovered to be the most useful? I'm thinking of buying the 4x steam tips, naked portafilter and tamp station as an absolute must. Thoughts?
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Spirit
Senior Member


Joined: 2 Mar 2006
Posts: 84
Location: Montreal, Qc, Canada
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Rocket R58
Grinder: Baratza Vario-W
Roaster: Hottop KN-8828P-2
Posted Wed Nov 28, 2012, 6:18am
Subject: Re: Rocket R58 Dual Boiler Machine Information and Picture
 

369 Said:

Thanks all for the response. I'm definitely keen on an R58!

What you notice with the R58 owners are although the machine may have 1 or 2 minor issues, the overall performance of the R58 whether we are talking about functionality or aesthetics outweigh the minor issues. Each to their own I guess.. especially on these highly involved and expensive little machines.

My other question is.. out of the dozen or so Rocket accessories such as tamps and espresso cups, which accessory have you discovered to be the most useful? I'm thinking of buying the 4x steam tips, naked portafilter and tamp station as an absolute must. Thoughts?

Posted November 28, 2012 link

I've bought the naked portafilter, rocket knock box, rocket pitcher (the one I had was due to be changed), tamp station.
I absolutely love them.

Let me know about the steam tips. I found the one I had with the machine (2 comes with it), were enough. But let me know your thoughts maybe it'll convince me!
I found the tamper that comes with it to be great too... I'm still not sure if I'd buy a more "fancy" one. The one that came with it, even though it has a brushed aluminum finish, is well balanced.

 
Max
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369
Senior Member


Joined: 26 Nov 2012
Posts: 3
Location: Australia
Expertise: I like coffee

Posted Wed Nov 28, 2012, 6:28am
Subject: Re: Rocket R58 Dual Boiler Machine Information and Picture
 

I think if you like your milk and for it to be done in a particular fashion, having the 4 steam (tip) options would be pretty handy. Us Aussies do like our milkier drinks or so I hear, hence for $25, I'm in.

I think I might also have to fork out for their fancy tamper, it's so shiny just like the R58.
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Augsburg57
Senior Member
Augsburg57
Joined: 3 Sep 2012
Posts: 33
Location: Seattle and Tucson
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Rocket R58
Grinder: Mazzer Mini E Type A
Posted Sat Dec 1, 2012, 8:44am
Subject: Re: Rocket R58 Dual Boiler Machine Information and Picture
 

369 Said:

This is my first post here and G'day from Australia! I'm a long time coffee addict but some what new to high end semi-professional machines.

After reading 19 pages of mixed reviews on the R58, I'm now sitting on the fence about my R58 purchase. I remembered being so excited about this machine just a few weeks ago :( On one hand I desperately want an upgrade and would be happy to pay extra for a nice DB machine but on the other side I'm concerned about the "unproven" reliability of this new machine.

Just wondering if there are any other new(er) R58 owners here.. would you mind sharing your experience so far? I'm hoping the latest batch of R58s are more reliable..

Do you guys think the R58 is still in the early stage / early adopter period or would now be a "safer" time to buy after several minor revisions including the boiler sensor upgrade?

Posted November 26, 2012 link

@369: My R58 has a June build date (purchased in the USA from SCG in September) and it has a couple of changes from the initial builds.  The thinner temperature probe and minor software changes for the PID.  I've used it daily for over two months now and it performs magnificently.  I'd absolutely recommend getting one.  I've owned a variety of home espresso machines and stove tops going back to the early 1980's.  This is far and away the best machine I've ever had.  It routinely surpasses the shots produced in the best, third wave coffee shops here in Seattle.  Albeit the shops are in production mode, and could do better if they could slow down.  Besides the shot quality, the machine itself is drop dead gorgeous.  I compared it with other machines side by side in SCG's retail store and there was no comparison when it comes to aesthetics. The only thing missing from the R58, in my opinion, is a 20 amp mode.  20 amps will require special wiring and receptacle in your kitchen, but would give the ability to heat the steam and brew boilers with more power simultaneously.  With the R58's 15 amp mode, I believe the system pulses power to both boilers and shares the 15 amps.  I steam and pull shots at the same time and 20 amps might send a little more juice to the steam boiler let me steam a bit faster.  It would not affect the shots.  Maybe a "Mark II" will come out some day with a 20 amp option.  However, life is short and I would not wait!
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TriHard
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TriHard
Joined: 24 Feb 2011
Posts: 36
Location: Silver Spring, MD
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Rocket R58
Grinder: Compak K10 Fresh
Posted Mon Dec 3, 2012, 7:12pm
Subject: Re: Rocket R58 Dual Boiler Machine Information and Picture
 

Can someone please tell me how you take off the top of the R58 to access the machine?  On the Cellini there were 2 allen screws that were under the cup warmer rack that you would unscrew and the top would come off.  It is obviously different on the R58...can someone please post how?  Thank you.
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AnthonyM
Senior Member
AnthonyM
Joined: 14 Aug 2012
Posts: 13
Location: Baltimore, MD

Espresso: Rocket R58, Rancillio Silvia...
Grinder: Mazzer Mini
Roaster: Hottop KN-8828
Posted Tue Dec 4, 2012, 8:52pm
Subject: Re: Rocket R58 Dual Boiler Machine Information and Picture
 

TriHard Said:

Can someone please tell me how you take off the top of the R58 to access the machine?  On the Cellini there were 2 allen screws that were under the cup warmer rack that you would unscrew and the top would come off.  It is obviously different on the R58...can someone please post how?  Thank you.

Posted December 3, 2012 link

There are four screws under the water reservoir cover, one in each corner. Take the cover off, and take out the reservoir before unscrewing.  This is demonstrated in the WLL Rocket Evoluzione tear down video (the R58 video doesn't show this).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJwq4wR8vds

I had to open mine up the other day to clean out the vacuum leaf valve.

 
Anthony M
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TriHard
Senior Member
TriHard
Joined: 24 Feb 2011
Posts: 36
Location: Silver Spring, MD
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Rocket R58
Grinder: Compak K10 Fresh
Posted Wed Dec 5, 2012, 6:39am
Subject: Re: Rocket R58 Dual Boiler Machine Information and Picture
 

Thank you.  I had called WLL about my intermittent pump failure and they suggested opening it up and looking for a loose connection.  Unfortunately, I didn't see anything that looked loose or wasn't making a good connection.  So, I guess I will just keep monitoring the situation to see if it happens more frequently or if I can figure out some pattern to reproduce the error.
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stinkyonion
Senior Member


Joined: 8 Jan 2013
Posts: 2
Location: Chicago suburbs
Expertise: Just starting

Posted Tue Jan 8, 2013, 11:55pm
Subject: Re: Rocket R58 Dual Boiler Machine Information and Picture
 

I have a R58 built in July 2012 (and bought in december 2012 from wholelattelove).  It has farenheit/celsius PID so I think it is a newer version.  It is fully plumbed.  My question pertains to not understanding preinfusion.  I thought that to preinfuse you lift handle to 45 degrees, and the line pressure gently wets the puck.  You then hold this position for about 5 seconds before lifting handle to full horizontal 90 degrees and starting the timer, aiming for 27 seconds.  The preinfusion is to gently wet the puck which makes the puck more homogenous and reduces frequency of channeling in the puck.

Now, the manual doesnt ever mention holding the handle in the 45 degree position.  When I do put it at 45 degrees, there is a "click" but nothing happens.  No water comes out of the group.  If the preinfusion starts when the handle is fully raised, and is controlled by the machine, should I add time to the timer?  When and for how long does preinfusion occur ?   Does it occur if you are not plumbed?  If I lift the handle all the way and the rotary pump turns on immediately then how can there be a gentle preinfusion?  Just dont understand preinfusion with R58.

As a side note, I hate the detached PID.  Now I keep it velcro'd to the bottom of front edge of drip tray and it looks factory installed.  It stays perfectly clean.  The cable is kept coiled under machine.  I have to bend real far down to read it though.

stinkyonion: GetAttachment.aspx.jpeg
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MartyRey
Senior Member


Joined: 12 Jul 2012
Posts: 9
Location: Texas
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Rockett Espresso R58
Grinder: Baratza Varo
Roaster: iRoast2
Posted Wed Jan 9, 2013, 7:28am
Subject: Re: Rocket R58 Dual Boiler Machine Information and Picture
 

When I first bought the R58 I think I had a subclinical level of obsession with the details. I think the way the brew group was designed was for line water pressure to enter the brew group in the 45 degree position, then then you lift the lever all the way, this allows you to go to full 9 bars of pressure when the pump is activated by the switch that gets pushed in with the lever cam.

I know the E61 brew group preinfusion doesn't work because nothing happened in the midway position. You can check this yourself by removing the portafiler, even the screen if you want, and watching what happens in the midway position. Nothing. I think (speculation here) that Rockett controls water flow internally with alot of solenoid valves and they do not allow line pressure to reach the E61 until the switch is turned on, activating the 9 bar pump. Sometimes you can nudge the level just a hair past the midway position, without turning on the pump, and line pressure does appear. WLL has a video a out this with their other machines. I finally gave up really trying to understand what was going on and just accepted that the design was for an automatic preinfusion anyway. The coffee taste great. The extraction on a naked portafiler was just fine. So I quit worrying about it. Probably why the manual says nothing about it. (P.S. if you are worried about channeling, just do a few naked portafiler shots .. you'll know it .. and be cleaning up a squirt of espresso somewhere)

I would be really cautious about your PID where you put it. It is bound to eventually get splashed. Getting replacement parts for the Rockett can be a challenge with the manufacturer in Italy and most wholesalers not interesting in keeping a bunch of expensive esoteric parts. The PID lets you make some settings, but you really shouldn't need to be changing these on a regular basis. I know looking at the brew temp is cool, but in reality, this is only measuring a point inside the brew boilerer. It has nothing to do with the thermal stability of the E61 brew head, which will take far longer to be ready for use. You'll get a perfect PID temp on the boiler early on, but when you push water through a brew head which is not up to thermal stability, the heat transfer will cause a substantial delta in temp loss and your ultimate water temp when the water hits the expresso will be far lower than ideal. So .... the PID really doesn't give you a lot of info you need to make a good cup of coffee. About the only reason I can imagine to leave it connected would be to to turn the steam boiler on and off depending upon your intentions that day. However, I even quit doing that because if I make pure espresso, I almost always dilute it down with warm water to make a Cafe Americano, so ... I need my steam boiler even when not making steamed milk drinks. So my PID is in a baggie up on a shelf.
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DavecUK
Senior Member


Joined: 21 Sep 2005
Posts: 1,411
Location: UK
Expertise: I love coffee

Posted Wed Jan 9, 2013, 9:11am
Subject: Re: Rocket R58 Dual Boiler Machine Information and Picture
 

This question keeps coming up

http://coffeetime.wikidot.com/e61-pre-infusion

In the Rocket there's no magic, no clever solenoids etc.. controlling this, it's simply 2 nuts that can be loosened and tightened to bring the microswitch contact at the back of the brew arm further in/out of the front panel.
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