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La Nuova Era Cuadra - very wet puck
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glcoffee
Senior Member


Joined: 15 Feb 2012
Posts: 67
Location: Los Angeles, CA & Taiwan
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Izzo Alex II
Grinder: Vario
Drip: Hario V60
Posted Fri Nov 30, 2012, 12:28am
Subject: La Nuova Era Cuadra - very wet puck
 

A friend of mine got her machine about 3 weeks ago.  I have been trying to dial it in and no matter what I try, the puck is overly wet.  Most times, a bed of water resides when the PF is removed,

Have tried over dosing, under dosing, different grinds and no matter what, the puck is still very wet.    With the same settings (coffee, grind, tamp) on my Alex Duetto, my puck is at most 'damp' and never wet.   Same setting is inferred as taking my equipment and trying to dial in her machine with the following:

- Single basket 7-8g, 20-24 second at 1oz
- Double basket 16-18g 20-24second at 2oz

I will try to take a photo of the wet puck and bed of water when possible.

 
“Some day you will be old enough to start reading fairy tales again.”
C.S. Lewis, The World's Last Night
------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------
I am Taiwanese.
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Markarian
Senior Member
Markarian
Joined: 27 Jun 2012
Posts: 658
Location: Seattle Area
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: ECM Technika IV Profi WT-WC
Grinder: Baratza Forte AP, HG One
Vac Pot: Bunn Trifecta MB
Drip: Moka, Aeropress, Hario V60
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Fri Nov 30, 2012, 1:12am
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra - very wet puck
 

Sounds like a bad 3 way solenoid valve. Try backflushing and see what happens, but if that valve is bad, the pressure buildup could be dangerous, so please use caution.
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qualin
Senior Member
qualin
Joined: 30 Jun 2012
Posts: 662
Location: Calgary, AB
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Izzo Alex Duetto 3
Grinder: Mazzer Mini Elect. Type A
Vac Pot: Looking to buy
Drip: Manual
Roaster: Considering?
Posted Fri Nov 30, 2012, 2:46am
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra - very wet puck
 

]Whoa Whoa Whoa... The La Nuova Era Cuadra has an E61 group, there isn't a 3-way solenoid valve..

Check this diagram out so that you get a better understanding on how a E61 group works:
Click Here (www.vernadesign.com)

Here's a video of a typical brewing cycle of an E61 group:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rc-5k4x0aUs

Try this.. Backflush with a blind basket and watch the base of the E61 group when the lever is pushed down. Do you get a spurt of water out of the base?

Now, can you knock out the puck or is the puck "Soupy"? What is the puck like when you use an 18 gram dose?

Are you still getting a decent shot from the machine despite the water on the puck? Let's start there.

 
Garbage In, Garbage Out, for every step of the process. From Beans to grinder, grounds to machine, coffee to cup.
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Markarian
Senior Member
Markarian
Joined: 27 Jun 2012
Posts: 658
Location: Seattle Area
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: ECM Technika IV Profi WT-WC
Grinder: Baratza Forte AP, HG One
Vac Pot: Bunn Trifecta MB
Drip: Moka, Aeropress, Hario V60
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Fri Nov 30, 2012, 4:30am
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra - very wet puck
 

Qualin is right and I'm an idiot, thinking of my own machine.

Another good point ^ Sometimes you can get a great shot, only to find a puddle waiting for you when you remove the handle.
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calblacksmith
Moderator
calblacksmith
Joined: 25 Nov 2007
Posts: 7,864
Location: Riverside, Ca, U.S.A.
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: ECM Vene. A1, La Cimbali M32
Grinder: Azkoyen Capriccio, Major
Vac Pot: 40s era Silex
Drip: Msl. Com. brewers
Roaster: gave it a try, decided no
Posted Fri Nov 30, 2012, 8:54am
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra - very wet puck
 

qualin Said:

Whoa Whoa Whoa... The La Nuova Era Cuadra has an E61 group, there isn't a 3-way solenoid valve..

Posted November 30, 2012 link

Well, in this instance you are right but with a volumetric dosed E61, there IS a 3 way valve. Or at lest it operates like it has one. Just saying :D

OH, BTW, nice links.

 
In real life, my name is
Wayne P.
Anything I post is personal opinion and is only worth as much as anyone else's personal opinion. YMMV!

Feed the newbs, starve the trolls and above all enjoy what you drink!
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SStones
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SStones
Joined: 24 Nov 2012
Posts: 477
Location: Canada
Expertise: Professional

Espresso: Giga 5, ECM Giotto, Rocket...
Grinder: Anfim Milano-Best
Vac Pot: No  :(
Drip: Some $30 thing from Walmart
Roaster: I buy pre-roasted.
Posted Sat Dec 1, 2012, 6:40am
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra - very wet puck
 

Apart from the wet puck, are there any other symptoms?  Is the shot pulling slowly, ie. taking a good 18 seconds to dispense an ounce? I'd like to ask "Does it sound normal?", but I know it's a new machine to both you and the owner...  But does it have any noises that make you think something is strange?
Do you have a way of checking and setting the relief valve's opening pressure?  Has it been set to something reasonable like 9.5 to 11 Bar? If you don't have a gauge to check it with, you can see if it has been left closed by listening to the pump wiuth the blind filter in. If your machine runs up to pressure and you can hear the pump stall (Drop to a hum instead of its normal buzz), then the relief valve isn't yet set.
DON'T do this pump-stall test over and over.  The brand new pumps can actually develop quite a lot of pressure and if the relief isn't protecting your machine it is stressful to your tubing and fittings.

Was it purchased new or used?  Does the previous owner/dealer have any suggestions or info about things that might have to be set, adjusted or fixed before the machine will be optimal?
From what I've seen of the batch of Cuadras sold through DirectBuy, the machines are complete but relief valves are all the way closed, not adjusted, hoses aren't always routed to the channel over the drip-tray and pressostats may be adjusted to anything from 0.6 to 1.7 Bar(Or whatever they left the MaTer factory at). You'll need to set these machines up to your needs just like the grinder.
When I've suggested before that these things need to be set-up, I have been corrected. A couple of owners say theirs came pre-adjusted. Maybe some retailers or their suppliers are different than others.

I wish you luck with you and your friend's new machine.  Post more if I/we can be of more help.
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glcoffee
Senior Member


Joined: 15 Feb 2012
Posts: 67
Location: Los Angeles, CA & Taiwan
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Izzo Alex II
Grinder: Vario
Drip: Hario V60
Posted Mon Dec 3, 2012, 9:55pm
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra - very wet puck
 

Thanks for all the replies.  I have asked my friend to take photos or a video if possible.  

There are no strange symptoms that I am aware of, to be honest, I have only my Alex II as a comparison.  The Cuadra was purchased new from Amazon.

 
“Some day you will be old enough to start reading fairy tales again.”
C.S. Lewis, The World's Last Night
------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------
I am Taiwanese.
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glcoffee
Senior Member


Joined: 15 Feb 2012
Posts: 67
Location: Los Angeles, CA & Taiwan
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Izzo Alex II
Grinder: Vario
Drip: Hario V60
Posted Thu Dec 6, 2012, 1:59am
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra - very wet puck
 

Photos updated.  18grams, 25second good crema.

http://imageshack.us/a/img507/4471/photo2ar.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img838/8866/photo3mhx.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img502/8631/photo4ch.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img571/7269/photo5zh.jpg

 
“Some day you will be old enough to start reading fairy tales again.”
C.S. Lewis, The World's Last Night
------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------
I am Taiwanese.
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erik82
Senior Member


Joined: 22 Oct 2012
Posts: 20
Location: The Netherlands
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Olympia Cremina 2013
Grinder: HG One 83mm #0083
Drip: Kalita Wave, Aeropress,...
Roaster: Gene Cafe
Posted Thu Dec 6, 2012, 3:51am
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra - very wet puck
 

Maybe the seal of the brew valve isn't working properly. Had this before and gave me wet pucks all the time. After renewing the seal all my pucks where dry. There is a check to see if it isn't working properly. Let the machine heat up as normal and don't run the pump while warming.

When the machine is heated set the lever to the brew position to turn the pump on. If it takes a couple of seconds for brewwater to come out of the group and air is coming out first then it could be the seal of the brew valve.
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glcoffee
Senior Member


Joined: 15 Feb 2012
Posts: 67
Location: Los Angeles, CA & Taiwan
Expertise: Just starting

Espresso: Izzo Alex II
Grinder: Vario
Drip: Hario V60
Posted Wed Dec 12, 2012, 12:25am
Subject: Re: La Nuova Era Cuadra - very wet puck
 

erik82 Said:

Maybe the seal of the brew valve isn't working properly. Had this before and gave me wet pucks all the time. After renewing the seal all my pucks where dry. There is a check to see if it isn't working properly. Let the machine heat up as normal and don't run the pump while warming.

When the machine is heated set the lever to the brew position to turn the pump on. If it takes a couple of seconds for brewwater to come out of the group and air is coming out first then it could be the seal of the brew valve.

Posted December 6, 2012 link

Reply from the vendor regarding wet pucks and stating it is normal.  Should  I be voice concerns?

An overly wet puck is normal, not all machines produce a dry hard puck. We have the solenoid set so it will drip a little to eliminate excess pressure from building up in the handle.


 
“Some day you will be old enough to start reading fairy tales again.”
C.S. Lewis, The World's Last Night
------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------
I am Taiwanese.
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 View Profile Link to this post
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