johnjacques Senior Member Joined: 10 Dec 2012 Posts: 26 Location: Los Angeles Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Salvatore Famosa / Elektra... Grinder: Baratza Vario
Posted Thu Feb 7, 2013, 4:56pm Subject: ESE pods with an E61 machine
I'll take all the abusive comments as read! I enjoy experimenting and I had a few ESE pods left over from when I first bought my Ascaso. One of its claims to fame was that it could swing both ways - ground and pods. Not really true of course, and I soon upgraded the brewhead to optimise ground brewing. That was a couple of years ago and I've since moved on to my current machines, a Salvatore and an Elektra MCSA. But I still had a few ancient Caffé Borbone pods lying around and today I played with them on the Salvatore, which has a standard E61 group, using a single basket. Result? Better than I expected. Working around the initial flow of basic water as the pod expanded to fit properly, I got a usable shot. Not great but not awful, particularly given that my pods were around a year after their use by date. Which made me wonder about just how good a shot you might get with better adapted hardware. The obvious changes would be to the basket and perhaps to a shallower portafilter fit but based on today's experiment an acceptable shot seems within reach. Why would you want to do this? With the best will in the world, espresso grinders and machines aren't user friendly in the sense that you need to learn how to use them and it takes a while. Enter the wife, gf, bf, dog, neighbor or armed robber who just wants a decent espresso without the master's degree. And I don't want any of the aforementioned breaking my expensive toys. Pods, if they could work well enough, are the perfect answer. They keep for at least a year, there's a huge range available and they're very hard to screw up. The trick will be to not compromise the existing design. Does anyone know of at the least a purpose designed basket or portafilter and basket to fit a standard E61 grouphead?
johnboddie Senior Member Joined: 28 Nov 2008 Posts: 153 Location: Virginia Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Brasilia Mini Classic,... Grinder: Rocky, KitchenAid Pro Drip: Cuisinart (non-grinding)
Posted Thu Feb 7, 2013, 5:13pm Subject: Re: ESE pods with an E61 machine
I had a basket that I used with my Brasilia Mini-Classic that was (I suppose) designed for pods. I used it for singles because it held a bit more than my single basket did. If you wanted to serve espresso in a space where there wasn't room for a grinder, or if you simply wanted to avoid the messiness of loose grounds, pods might offer a workable alternative.
johnjacques Senior Member Joined: 10 Dec 2012 Posts: 26 Location: Los Angeles Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Salvatore Famosa / Elektra... Grinder: Baratza Vario
Posted Thu Feb 7, 2013, 5:21pm Subject: Re: ESE pods with an E61 machine
No question that pods can work as I've outlined. The question relates to suitable hardware. Larger than a standard single basket wouldn't be the way to go!
Markarian Senior Member Joined: 27 Jun 2012 Posts: 475 Location: Seattle Area Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Modded Nuova Simonelli Oscar Grinder: Vario-W, Mazzer Super Jolly Drip: Moka, Aeropress, Melitta 102 Roaster: Wear-Ever Popcorn Pumper
Posted Thu Feb 7, 2013, 5:40pm Subject: Re: ESE pods with an E61 machine
I can't speak to E61, but on Nuova Simonelli, it requires not only a specialized basket but actually changing the diffuser block and shower screen. When I first got my machine, I was mystified as to why I couldn't fit the portafilter on the group until someone gently pointed out to me that I had the pod kit, which I didn't even know existed for my machine.
johnjacques Senior Member Joined: 10 Dec 2012 Posts: 26 Location: Los Angeles Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Salvatore Famosa / Elektra... Grinder: Baratza Vario
Posted Thu Feb 7, 2013, 6:22pm Subject: Re: ESE pods with an E61 machine
That's the easy way and the best if you want pods at any cost. Several manufacturers offer that option. That's not the issue here. My experience with a standard portafilter and single basket leads me to believe that there's a workable solution without compromising the normal grounds performance.
Obviously, pressurized is a problem but we're getting there. I like the idea of adjustable depth. A good seal from the outset is key to a successful solution.
johnjacques Senior Member Joined: 10 Dec 2012 Posts: 26 Location: Los Angeles Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Salvatore Famosa / Elektra... Grinder: Baratza Vario
Posted Fri Feb 8, 2013, 9:20am Subject: Re: ESE pods with an E61 machine
Excellent! I knew it had to exist. Looking as closely as the picture allows, the main difference between this and the standard single basket is the profile of the sloped surface that joins the sides to the base. It looks almost flat at the start and then falls off fast. I'm guessing that this will fix the issue of water forcing its way around the pod before it expands. The unknown factor is whether this will be enough to provide sufficient backpressure to trigger the preinfusion cycle. (I'm assuming that it's backpressure that's the trigger.) With a standard single basket, there is not.
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