AlexKilpatrick Senior Member Joined: 30 Jan 2013 Posts: 117 Location: Austin
Espresso: Breville Dual Boiler Grinder: Bairtiza Vario
Posted Mon Feb 18, 2013, 2:38pm Subject: Re: Quick Mill Vetrano vs. Breville Dual Boiler
JasonBrandtLewis Said:
It's not a taxi meter . . . who cares whether it's 5 minutes or 50? "Labor charges are $100/hour to start" usually means -- in English, as opposed to the precise mathematical formulae of engineer-speak -- there's a minimum labor charge of one hour. Add to that the expense of shipping (or driving to a repair center), etc., etc. and you're well north of $100, not south.
It matters because the repair is extremely likely to take less than an hour. Thus is will most probably be $100. That would be true if they replaced the o-rings as well.
cuznvin Senior Member Joined: 6 Oct 2011 Posts: 418 Location: NY Expertise: I love coffee
Posted Mon Feb 18, 2013, 2:41pm Subject: Re: Quick Mill Vetrano vs. Breville Dual Boiler
AlexKilpatrick Said:
Glad to do it. I know this may come as a shock to those of you who aren't mathematically inclined, but posts on a coffee snob forum are no exactly a statistical sample. People tend not to post 'My machine is fine, no problems!'
I seem to recall BubbaDude posting that even if his machine needs some repairs, he is still coming out ahead compared to the $3000+ machines. I don't know why he would go back on that now, just because it affects him personally. The o-ring problem he mentioned was well known, and fixed in later implementations. There is certainly a risk you take on trying out a new design, and every new design is going to have flaws. But without risk, there is no innovation. Breville has been really good about fixing these problems for people who have been affected. I don't know why they are being resistant in this case, other than it being some issue with their deal with Amazon Warehouse. This is the first case I have heard of them being unwilling to do a repair.
cuznvin Senior Member Joined: 6 Oct 2011 Posts: 418 Location: NY Expertise: I love coffee
Posted Mon Feb 18, 2013, 2:42pm Subject: Re: Quick Mill Vetrano vs. Breville Dual Boiler
AlexKilpatrick Said:
It matters because the repair is extremely likely to take less than an hour. Thus is will most probably be $100. That would be true if they replaced the o-rings as well.
AlexKilpatrick Senior Member Joined: 30 Jan 2013 Posts: 117 Location: Austin
Espresso: Breville Dual Boiler Grinder: Bairtiza Vario
Posted Mon Feb 18, 2013, 2:42pm Subject: Re: Quick Mill Vetrano vs. Breville Dual Boiler
cuznvin Said:
Seems like Alex is doing everything in his power to make Bubbas situation look like a non issue. Just give it up already. Not for anything, but do you have any idea of the working conditions in China? Do you want to support that?
I hope you don't have a smartphone. Or a laptop. What exactly are you supporting?
One data point is not a line. Without knowing the failure rates of the machines in the wild, we don't know anything. And by "we" I mean me and all the other people posting here as if they know how unreliable this machine is.
We don't know how many they have sold; we don't know how many have failed. And you can't infer a failure rate from forum posts. I expect way less than 1% of the people who buy one even know this forum even exists. The actual failure rate could be 50% It could be .01%.
cuznvin Senior Member Joined: 6 Oct 2011 Posts: 418 Location: NY Expertise: I love coffee
Posted Mon Feb 18, 2013, 2:44pm Subject: Re: Quick Mill Vetrano vs. Breville Dual Boiler
AlexKilpatrick Said:
I hope you don't have a smartphone. Or a laptop. What exactly are you supporting?
One data point is not a line. Without knowing the failure rates of the machines in the wild, we don't know anything. And by "we" I mean me and all the other people posting here as if they know how unreliable this machine is.
We don't know how many they have sold; we don't know how many have failed. And you can't infer a failure rate from forum posts. I expect way less than 1% of the people who buy one even know this forum even exists. The actual failure rate could be 50% It could be .01%.
The less Chinese products we buy, the better... JMHO.. You an talk until you are blue in the face. I dont think you are going to convince many of us that a BDB is worth the investment.
crazy4espresso Senior Member Joined: 19 Jan 2008 Posts: 105 Location: Toronto Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: Rancilio Silvia, La Pavoni... Grinder: Rancilio Rocky
Posted Mon Feb 18, 2013, 2:53pm Subject: Re: Quick Mill Vetrano vs. Breville Dual Boiler
cuznvin Said:
The less Chinese products we buy, the better... JMHO.. You an talk until you are blue in the face. I dont think you are going to convince many of us that a BDB is worth the investment.
Plenty of threads concerning machines that cost 5x as much encountering problems very soon in their lifecycle, so blasting this one based on one owner's experience is an unfair assessment. Are you saying there are no Chinese electronics in more expensive equipment? Face it friend, Chinese products are everywhere and they're here to stay.
cuznvin Senior Member Joined: 6 Oct 2011 Posts: 418 Location: NY Expertise: I love coffee
Posted Mon Feb 18, 2013, 2:56pm Subject: Re: Quick Mill Vetrano vs. Breville Dual Boiler
crazy4espresso Said:
Plenty of threads concerning machines that cost 5x as much encountering problems very soon in their lifecycle, so blasting this one based on one owner's experience is an unfair assessment. Are you saying there are no Chinese electronics in more expensive equipment? Face it friend, Chinese products are everywhere and they're here to stay.
JasonBrandtLewis Senior Member Joined: 9 Dec 2005 Posts: 6,099 Location: Berkeley, CA Expertise: I live coffee
Espresso: Elektra T1 - La Valentina -... Grinder: Mahlkönig K30 Vario -... Vac Pot: Yama 5-cup Drip: CCD, Chemex Roaster: No, no, not another...
Posted Mon Feb 18, 2013, 3:29pm Subject: Re: Quick Mill Vetrano vs. Breville Dual Boiler
AlexKilpatrick Said:
Glad to do it. I know this may come as a shock to those of you who aren't mathematically inclined, but posts on a coffee snob forum are no exactly a statistical sample. People tend not to post 'My machine is fine, no problems!'
Well, if it makes you feel any better, that's EXACTLY the type of posts people make -- regardless of inclination or ability. Every time someone asks, What-machine-should-I-buy type questions, the majority of the posts are "Get mine -- my machine is fine, no problems!" regardless of whether their machine is appropriate for the individual asking the question.
AlexKilpatrick Said:
I seem to recall BubbaDude posting that even if his machine needs some repairs, he is still coming out ahead compared to the $3000+ machines.
Are we talking about coffee, or the next quantum leap in putting humans in space, or solving the issues of global warming? Brevile didn't invent $#|+, and certainly not the DB . . .
AlexKilpatrick Said:
Breville has been really good about fixing these problems for people who have been affected.
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