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Inconsistency in shot volume with Crossland CC1
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Discussions > Espresso > Machines > Inconsistency in...  
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trayraynor
Senior Member
trayraynor
Joined: 9 Feb 2014
Posts: 11
Location: USA
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Crossland CC1 v1.5
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Drip: Clever
Roaster: Toastess TCP-713
Posted Thu May 29, 2014, 7:19am
Subject: Inconsistency in shot volume with Crossland CC1
 

I'm looking for guidance on how to obtain consistent volume from the shots I pull.  I've had the Crossland CC1 for a little more than 2 weeks and over the last two days I've had challenges obtaining consistent volume shot-to-shot. Sometimes I get less than 1 oz., other times more than 2 oz. Here are the facts:

2 seconds pre-infusion
2 seceonds wait time
20 seconds pour time
temp: 205 F
tamp: 34.5 pounds (as measured on my bath scale)
coffee: Espresso Moto (Cafe Moto) ground by roaster for espresso (told them I have a CC1)
freshness of coffee: roasted May 27th; ground May 27th

I fill the portafilter basket and have the coffee form a little mound. I gently spread over the portafilter to ensure uniformity of the coverage, and gently scrape the excess coffee off, leveling with the portafilter basket. I then tamp (using the tamper included with the CC1) and do my best to press evenly (three fingers in a triangle pattern) until the tamper top is level with the portafilter basket. I've followed this process numerous times and believe that I'm applying the same, or nearly similar amount of pressure each time, and I'm not making any other changes to the parameters described above. Yet, the shot volume varies widely.

I would appreciate any insights, suggestions or corrections you may offer.

Thanks,

Ray
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CMIN
Senior Member


Joined: 14 Jun 2012
Posts: 1,385
Location: South FL
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: Crossland CC1
Grinder: Baratza Preciso
Posted Thu May 29, 2014, 9:39am
Subject: Re: Inconsistency in shot volume with Crossland CC1
 

Impossible to pull good or consistent shots as your seeing with preground. Grounds are stale within 15 min. And even if they grind for espresso won't matter as the grinder is dialed in for their machines, not yours. Just as an example I pull about 1.7oz in 27-30 seconds timed after 1st drip (after preinfuse etc)

You need to get an espresso grinder, and a scale measuring to .1g otherwise just filling the basket your weight can be all over the place and cause more inconsistencies. I dose around 16-17g usually.
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NightFlight
Senior Member


Joined: 30 Apr 2013
Posts: 20
Location: Great Lakes Bay Region
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: BDB920BSXL
Grinder: Ceado E37s
Vac Pot: Cona
Drip: Brazen
Roaster: Behmor
Posted Thu May 29, 2014, 11:01am
Subject: Re: Inconsistency in shot volume with Crossland CC1
 

CMIN is 100% correct. Grinder! Grinder! Grinder!

 
Coffee is a language in itself.
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takeshi
Senior Member
takeshi
Joined: 12 Oct 2002
Posts: 986
Location: Houston
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Alex Duetto 3.0
Grinder: Super Jolly
Roaster: Amaya Roasting
Posted Thu May 29, 2014, 11:35am
Subject: Re: Inconsistency in shot volume with Crossland CC1
 

Part of the reason why we always emphasize the importance of the grinder.
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trayraynor
Senior Member
trayraynor
Joined: 9 Feb 2014
Posts: 11
Location: USA
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Crossland CC1 v1.5
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Drip: Clever
Roaster: Toastess TCP-713
Posted Thu May 29, 2014, 12:52pm
Subject: Re: Inconsistency in shot volume with Crossland CC1
 

Yes. My Baratza Vario is on order, I was hoping to dial in my shot setup, at least partially, while I'm waiting for the grinder to arrive. I guess I will sit and suffer through some pour over coffee until next week.

In the meantime, I guess I could use some schooling on the importance of using freshly ground beans, versus beans that were ground say two days earlier; is it the moisture content of the older (by one or two days) ground coffee has diminished so much that no matter how well someone doses, and applies the tamper, that the puck cannot achieve a sufficient density to result in the proper back pressure?
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D4F
Senior Member


Joined: 15 Mar 2012
Posts: 2,021
Location: USA
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: Gaggia Classic PID
Grinder: Baratza Forte-AP
Posted Thu May 29, 2014, 12:55pm
Subject: Re: Inconsistency in shot volume with Crossland CC1
 

A great read to start the journey  :)

http://www.espressomyespresso.com/

    12   EASY GUIDE TO BETTER ESPRESSO AT HOME

 
D4F also at
http://www.gaggiausersgroup.com/
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SproBro
Senior Member


Joined: 11 Feb 2014
Posts: 75
Location: Topeka, KS
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: CC1 v1.5
Grinder: Compak K10PB, Vario
Posted Thu May 29, 2014, 1:24pm
Subject: Re: Inconsistency in shot volume with Crossland CC1
 

Another thing is, your coffee is only 2 daysish off the roast. I'd recommend about five days post roast for optimal flavor developement, and ease of pulling as an espresso. 1 or 2 days and I found I got all kinds of channelling problems - 5-7 days and it magically turned to great pours with the same technique.

If you have a bottomless portafilter, set your pour time to like 40 seconds, and  try to manually stop it at the blonding point. It might get messy if you have alot of channelling though.
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BarryR
Senior Member


Joined: 21 Nov 2010
Posts: 279
Location: Wilbraham
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: CC1
Grinder: Baratza Preciso
Drip: Behmor Brazen, Clever...
Roaster: Hottop KN-8828B2-K
Posted Fri May 30, 2014, 1:59pm
Subject: Re: Inconsistency in shot volume with Crossland CC1
 

I'm not arguing the need to fresh grind but shouldn't coffee ground by the roaster for espresso at least be consistent?
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SproBro
Senior Member


Joined: 11 Feb 2014
Posts: 75
Location: Topeka, KS
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: CC1 v1.5
Grinder: Compak K10PB, Vario
Posted Fri May 30, 2014, 6:28pm
Subject: Re: Inconsistency in shot volume with Crossland CC1
 

I would bet they used a all-purpose bulk grinder, and not an espresso grinder as well. Despite how good some bulk grinders are, it is my impression that they are not designed for the specific character of the grind necessary in espresso.

To answer the question:
Is it fair to ask a barista to change a hopper, finish grinding out whats in the grinder, grind your beans, and then recalibrate their several thousand dollar machine just for a pound of coffee that will stale in a few minutes? Maybe if you slip them a twenty, share the wealth.
I think its convenient shops offer to grind your coffee, albeit not in your best interest, but courteous nonetheless. :3
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trayraynor
Senior Member
trayraynor
Joined: 9 Feb 2014
Posts: 11
Location: USA
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Crossland CC1 v1.5
Grinder: Baratza Vario
Drip: Clever
Roaster: Toastess TCP-713
Posted Sun Jun 1, 2014, 6:58am
Subject: Re: Inconsistency in shot volume with Crossland CC1
 

SproBro Said:

Another thing is, your coffee is only 2 daysish off the roast. I'd recommend about five days post roast for optimal flavor developement, and ease of pulling as an espresso. 1 or 2 days and I found I got all kinds of channelling problems - 5-7 days and it magically turned to great pours with the same technique.

If you have a bottomless portafilter, set your pour time to like 40 seconds, and  try to manually stop it at the blonding point. It might get messy if you have alot of channelling though.

Posted May 29, 2014 link

The arrival of my grinder (Baratza Vario) is this coming week. Meanwhile, i've dropping by my local roastery, Cafe Moto, picking up frshly roasted beans and having them grind them for me. The grind occurs in the roasting plant and on Thursday of this week 8 asked them to grind one setting finer. Now, I'm getting far more consistent pours, and pretty good crema. I've also consistently dosed by volume, and that seems to contribute to the consistency.

I will roast the SM Espresso Monkey on Monday, the Vario arrives Wednesday, so Thurdsay am (four days post roasting) I'll grind my first batch for a test and I'll post the results here.
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