espressoDOM Senior Member Joined: 1 May 2003 Posts: 2,189 Location: Bay Area Expertise: I love coffee
Espresso: WEGA Lyra (vibe) Grinder: Mazzer Mini Vac Pot: (no more coffee equipment) Drip: French Press Roaster: Hot Top Roaster; Fresh Roast...
Posted Wed Sep 3, 2003, 7:52am Subject: Street Legal Silvia....
Erasing the cool factor that goes along with having a HX machine vs. say i dunno.... Ms. Silvia.....
Erasing grass is greener factors such as I can steam and pull shots simultaneously neener neener factor....
Is the upgrade ultimately necessary or is it just something to aspire to as you grow in your knowledge of espresso.... I am a novice and don't feel it that important to spend the extra money until I can make effortless espresso shots on the machine I have, but I did want to know what I am missing or if I am missing much ..... except what I stated above
DOM...evil genius ...Up to no good in espresso at all times... VIVA la parts de Espresso
I forgot to ask part of the question... If I add the adjustable 15 degree angled portafilter from espressoparts.com along with the triple basket will it help add to the performance of my machine. I am going to hang on to Silvia for at least a year or two before I move over to a Millenium or another one of the HX machines.... sorry for the two posts...
DOM...evil genius ...Up to no good in espresso at all times... VIVA la parts de Espresso
If I wasn't already convinced, our Rematch of Rocky versus Mazzer Mini demonstrated to me that beyond a certain point, it's mostly about convenience and consistency. Two of the top three shots that day were from Silvia/Mazzer but they required careful temperature surfing. Two weeks later and my buddy has yet to duplicate those results (he's blaming it on Mars moving away from the Earth :-o). La Valentina/Mazzer continue to chug out pretty much the same result as the day of that shootout.
Convenience No temperature surfing, no waiting for steam. I inline plumbed and added a drain, all for the convenience. With Silvia, I found it was impractical to serve more than 2-3 people. With La Valentina, large groups are no problem. It's always waiting for me, not the other way around.
Consistency The variation for La Valentina/Mazzer shots is quite small. Some are great, most are very good, and very very few are bad. With meticulous care, Silvia/Mazzer can produce the same results. I attribute most of this to temperature stability.
Bottom line: How much are you willing to pay for convenience? Shot-for-shot, you'll have a hard time beating your current setup.
espressoDOM Said:
If I add the adjustable 15 degree angled portafilter from espressoparts.com along with the triple basket will it help add to the performance of my machine
Mike Walsh (CupaJoeKid) pulled shots from the "ultimate upgrade" triple PF for me. I didn't taste a noteworthy difference but Mike already has a pretty darn good setup / routine (Rocky + PID'd Silvia and years of practice). Some believe it is indispensable (The 3x Basket & The Elusive God Shot). YMMV.
Dan I am asking this question because my jedi skills are lacking and reading comprehension was never my strong suit... VISUAL thinker....here goes....
Temperature surfing is got me lost... it seems to be very important in getting the most out of Silvia. I have read the journal entry that everyone links to.... I don't get it (dumb look on my face)
dumb down how it works for me.... somebody help out the idiot in the corner....
hey...i am really not an idiot...hehehe
DOM...evil genius ...Up to no good in espresso at all times... VIVA la parts de Espresso
The short answer is that Silvia's temperatures vary because the thermostat has a fairly wide range between its turn on (too cold) and turn off (hot enough) point. To convince yourself, time how long it is between the time the boiler light goes off and when it comes on again (when Silvia is idle). It is several minutes. Let's say during this cooling period you decide to pull a shot. What is the output temperature at that moment? Well, that depends on how long it's been cooling down. Temperature surfing (which more accurately would be called "time surfing") means always starting your brew cycle at the same time during the cooling phase so you can pick your temperature accurately.
Read My Espresso is Cold! and try a test. Let Silvia warm up completely and measure 3oz of water using the "styrofoam cup" technique. Do this several times with no particular pattern. What do you see? 185F? 202F? Maybe even 206F? The goal is to see the same temperature every time. Since the "boiler off" light is the same starting point (max temperature attained), if you wait same amount of time, you'll get precisely the same temperature, time after time.
Temperature accuracy (= same each time) and stability (= same during shot) are distinguishing features of better espresso machines. Stability -> lots 'o brass. Accuracy -> lots of water, good thermostat / pressurestat, etc. Silvia's got the brass; temperature surfing is trying to improve on the accuracy.
I am starting to see the difference. I left Silvia on while I was working out yesterday. When I got done I ran some water thru the PF and let it sit until the light went off for about 3 minutes. The crema was much higher than normal and it billowed out of the PF slowly. It was a couple good double shots out of mediocre Whole Foods Beans.
The journey continues
DOM...evil genius ...Up to no good in espresso at all times... VIVA la parts de Espresso
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