Greetings! How are you? I'm opening a Mediterranean Restaurant in Niagara Falls, Canada. The capacity is 120 people. There are many european, (esp Italian) locals, and a plethora of tourists. I want to specialize in Greek/Turkish grind/coffee, as well as good espresso, cappucino, latte, americano.
The estimated forementioned coffees that we will be serving each day are 15-30. A fast, easy to use (easy for new staff to learn/comprehend), reliable, commercial machine that can give me two espressos at once is ideal. A machine that also takes water tank/resevoir is ideal. Also looking for obe thats not enourmous in size.
As far as grinders go, i've been hearing a lot of positive reviews for the Baratza Vario Grinder. What are my options? What do you recommend for my setting and wants? What can accomodate my business the best, and be friendly for my staff/servers who obviously can't be soending there time with coffee, when there's food and tables to be looked after?
Keep in mind, i am also on a tight business. opening a restaurant from scratch has drained my savings and us quite the project. So, i am also looking for lowest prices.
2 group machines (ones that do 2 espressos at once) will be larger and cost a lot more than one group. (head) If you are sure you are only going to do 15-30 a day I would look hard at the small, NSF rated, can be bought to be plumbed in or use a tank Oscar. I am sure he can do 30 a day with no issues and I have done that many at a party at work. If you are going to a lot more than that you should look at a larger machine. Your coffee vendors will often help with grinders and machines.
I also love my Vario W. At 30 shots a day I think it would be fine at least for a while. You might have to replace it more often over the years than a more commercial grinder, however, the mess and ease of use will be worth it, (in my opinion) at least if your coffee sales stay that low. If you sell a lot more coffee, then I would get a beefier grinder. But they are a lot messier and larger. I love the preset weights on the vario W and think that would be awesome for restaurant for the waiters to push a button and get the right amount out of the grinder with no guesswork. Maybe in a few years they will make a Vario W cafe model that does that in a beefier package. Right now I am not sold that it will stand up to years of abuse in a cafe but I am sure Oscar can.
If you are not going to train staff to pull a shot you can look at super automatics. However, they are not considered as good for real espresso.
Actually the specialty is lamb, souvlaki, gyro, pastichio, mousaka, salads, roasts at stuffed peppers :).
Sorry, i'm espresso/coffee illiterate. What i meant was, out of the coffee selection, Greek/Turkish is what will be the "house blend" or specialty so to speak. Not that the business itself will specialize in coffee. Most beverage sales will be beer, wine, juice & pop.
I took a look at the Oscar, and i'm impressed.
I'm tempted of buying a superautomatic for the convenience and ability of new staff, or even trained staff during rush hour, nit being able to give the brewing/coffee making process its proper attention. It would be ideal for the server to be able to multi-task, and create an easier (lower stress) environment for them. I am discouraged however, of the negative feedback a large percentage if people give on SA's. I don't know if much if this comes from traditionalists, or those in fear that baristas will lose business or there will be a decline in demand for traditional machines or baristas, because of "ribots" taking over for the sake if convenience?
I do wish to keep the flavour rich, the crema creamy, the milk hot, the beans fresh: but not at the expense of slowing down my service and making things too hard for my staff.
I could be way off, so any opinions and advice us greatly appreciated. Thank you!
I suggest you go to starbucks and taste super autos plain espresso then go to a good espresso shop or pull your own and see the difference for yourself. The supers autos will make things average with no training and that is why Starbucks moved from real machines and grinders to them. Italian cafes pull good shots, I hear. I can't believe N. American cafes can't do the same.
We had a thread on this about restaurants and coffee and the lack of attention to coffee. There is a good mark up to espresso. The upshot is they should have at least one person that knows coffee like they do for wine. That person would pick the beans, train the staff, make sure the machines are set correctly and cleaned, etc. Be QA for coffee just like they do for wine. In mexico, at a nice restaurant, I ordered a coffee based after dinner drink and they brought out a cart to the table, caramelized sugar on the rim of the glass and brewed the coffee on the cart. Reminded me a lot of flaming crepes, very impressive. I know they sold more coffee to the people around me after they saw mine.
Coffeenoobie
Buying advice: GRINDER GRINDER GRINDER. Don't cheap out on the grinder. My coffee treasure map... Click Here (maps.google.com)
A used commercial machine might be a good buy if it all works, but 3 group is huge. And even on commercial machines I like the ones that you can judge the pour rather than the preset buttons. It is only 30 seconds to watch the pour. See training videos linked below.
You need a machine that is rated for commercial use. I did not look up all of them, but the names I recognize are not commercial rated machines and some are known to be very hard to pull a good shot on.
I suggest you go to a commercial show room and have them show you how they work. (and taste the espresso) Do not even look at home machines. Oscar can be used at home but it is a low volume commercial machine. That is part of the reason I bought it. And I got it from a cafe that used it for catering events. They just did not have enough of those so it sat around for a few years and they sold it to me.
Coffeenoobie
Buying advice: GRINDER GRINDER GRINDER. Don't cheap out on the grinder. My coffee treasure map... Click Here (maps.google.com)
From their site: "Commercial features of the Rancilio Silvia include heavy duty brass boiler and commercial size 58mm grouphead and portafilter handle, copper piping and metal body with brushed stainless steel panelling. Miss Silvia has been around for many years... its stylish design and semi commercial components has made her the most popular espresso machine and along with the new Baratza Vario, the options are endless!"
I'm sure the Rancilio Epoca ST1, is more of a commercial machine. And perhaps one of the most ideal machines would probable be a machine like the Pasquini Livia 90 Automatic or NUOVA SIMONELLI APPIA 1 GROUP?
Semi-automatic machines like the Quick Mill Andreja Premium Redesign, claim to be semi-commercial. Automatic machines like the Jura XS90 (Up to 50 cups per day - 7 days a week), claim to be commercial too.
Wouldn't this fit the category of a mid-scale/mid-size restaurant, with no crazy/large sales in coffee (in comparison to cafe's or breakfast diners)?
Symbols: = New Posts since your last visit = No New Posts since last visit = Newest post
Forum Rules: No profanity, illegal acts or personal attacks will be tolerated in these discussion boards. No commercial posting of any nature will be tolerated; only private sales by private individuals, in the "Buy and Sell" forum. No cross posting allowed - do not post your topic to more than one forum, nor repost a topic to the same forum. Who Can Read The Forum? Anyone can read posts in these discussion boards. Who Can Post New Topics? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post new topics. Who Can Post Replies? Any registered CoffeeGeek member can post replies. Can Photos be posted? Anyone can post photos in their new topics or replies. Who can change or delete posts? Any CoffeeGeek member can edit their own posts. Only moderators can delete posts. Probationary Period: If you are a new signup for CoffeeGeek, you cannot promote, endorse, criticise or otherwise post an unsolicited endorsement for any company, product or service in your first five postings.
= No New Posts since last visit 