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Coffee seems to stale faster with upgraded espresso machine?
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Discussions > Espresso > Q and A > Coffee seems to...  
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Mstgeorge
Senior Member


Joined: 21 Feb 2014
Posts: 2
Location: MA
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Expobar brewtus iv r
Grinder: Compak k3 touch
Posted Tue Mar 18, 2014, 7:44pm
Subject: Coffee seems to stale faster with upgraded espresso machine?
 

Hey everyone, first post love the forums,

Recently upgraded from a gaggia classic to an expobar brewtus iv a couple months ago and used the gaggia for a year. Have been buying coffee as close to roast date as possible and it always starts off real nice. The problem is it seems to be going bad faster than it used to and giving a nasty bitter flavor. With the gaggia things started off nice then would slowly get more stale over a couple weeks, with the expobar it seems to fall off a cliff after about six or seven days.  Does anybody else notice this more with a fancier machine, do these machines exaggerate the subtleties more? Have I changed something I might not be picking up on with my routine or machine settings?

I might add that this has only seemed to effect that last four or five bags. I thought it was low brew temp at first so I messed with that a little then went nuts cleaning the machine a few times and it really does seem like it's the coffee because with a fresh bag it gets better for a while.

Any suggestions much appreciated
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ljguitar
Senior Member
ljguitar
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 2,805
Location: Cheyenne
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Expobar Pulsar
Grinder: Mazzer SuperJolly • Baratza
Drip: Bunn • AeroPress
Roaster: Behmor•Variacs
Posted Wed Mar 26, 2014, 10:27am
Subject: Re: Coffee seems to stale faster with upgraded espresso machine?
 

Mstgeorge Said:

…it really does seem like it's the coffee because with a fresh bag it gets better for a while.

Posted March 18, 2014 link

Hi mst…
You seem to have answered your own question. The better the machine, the more the flaws begin to show up. So as beans age/stale, you can taste that more easily when brewed in a better machine.

My solution for the past 13 years has been to roast my own coffee and only roast enough as needed (or roast and freeze beans before 6-8 week RV vacations so we don't have to haul a roaster along).

Buying close to roast date is one way to cope. If you buy surplus, then freezing it till needed is also a way to have fresher beans in the grinder hopper.


°

 
L  a  r  r  Y          J

<°)))><
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steamer
Senior Member
steamer
Joined: 11 Feb 2005
Posts: 900
Location: socal
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Expobar Brewtus IV R
Grinder: Mazzer Mini-B Baratza...
Vac Pot: Krubs Moka Brew, vacPot
Drip: TechV, and many more
Roaster: Hottop
Posted Wed Mar 26, 2014, 2:23pm
Subject: Re: Coffee seems to stale faster with upgraded espresso machine?
 

as the beans get older, they will griind differently, and thus affect the shot, I generally dont go over 14 days on roast date. I stopped roasting my own beans so I can get used to my machine and grinder first. I will go back to raosting every sunday very soon. Untill then I.m buying beans, but all are fresh and I dont use beans before 4 days after roast,
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emradguy
Senior Member
emradguy
Joined: 31 Mar 2011
Posts: 3,024
Location: Houston
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Duetto II; Twist v2
Grinder: M Major, Macap M4 x2, VDD...
Drip: Espro presses; Aeropress
Roaster: H-B "List of Favorites"
Posted Thu Mar 27, 2014, 7:13am
Subject: Re: Coffee seems to stale faster with upgraded espresso machine?
 

there's more to balancing a shot than adjusting the brew temperature...as you probably know.  As beans age, you need to modify your grind, or you're going to get a different extraction and flavor profile thgan you did when they were right off roast, or at peak of 4 days off roast.  I suggest reading through Jim Schulman's Espresso 101 post How to adjust dose and grind... on home-barista.com  It'll give you some real tools to use to balance shots and get what you want from the beans.

 
.
Always remember the most important thing is what ends up in your cup!
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Mstgeorge
Senior Member


Joined: 21 Feb 2014
Posts: 2
Location: MA
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Expobar brewtus iv r
Grinder: Compak k3 touch
Posted Sun Mar 30, 2014, 6:55am
Subject: Re: Coffee seems to stale faster with upgraded espresso machine?
 

Thanks for the suggestions!

There's some great info on that home barista page. Have seen stuff about weighing your coffee and shots before but never its direct correlation to flavor. Been reluctant to use lower doses because I'm paranoid about not filling the basket all the way but I'll definitely break out the scale again and try it.

Never expected to be getting this deep when I started out. There are just so many variables to coax into place and they're in constant flux. It's almost like every single cup is a unique serendipity and you may never get it exactly the same but they are all desirable in their own ways and get better as you improve.
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emradguy
Senior Member
emradguy
Joined: 31 Mar 2011
Posts: 3,024
Location: Houston
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Duetto II; Twist v2
Grinder: M Major, Macap M4 x2, VDD...
Drip: Espro presses; Aeropress
Roaster: H-B "List of Favorites"
Posted Sun Mar 30, 2014, 9:35am
Subject: Re: Coffee seems to stale faster with upgraded espresso machine?
 

Yes, it is a life long learning process, addiction, habit...whatever. Some even call it a rabbit hole. When I started, I had no idea I'd ever end up with the gear I have now. I recall being very, very envious of those who did. I still envy some people and their apparent freedom to but the cream of the crop in everything coffee whenever they please. I guess I'm kind of one of them, but for me there's a lot of scraping and saving, and a heck of a lot of waiting, so I can diminish the angry wife effect.

 
.
Always remember the most important thing is what ends up in your cup!
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acasabia
Senior Member
acasabia
Joined: 17 Oct 2008
Posts: 614
Location: Westchester, NY
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Expobar Brewtus iv-p,...
Grinder: Quamar M80e, Hario slim
Vac Pot: Yama Vacpot, Aeropress,
Drip: french press
Roaster: hot-air popper.
Posted Sun Mar 30, 2014, 3:13pm
Subject: Re: Coffee seems to stale faster with upgraded espresso machine?
 

I just came to say that when I upgraded to a brewtus, I also felt the sting of stale coffee.

I now try and stay within 14 days of roast, but I've learned to play with the grind, temp, and volume.

Now I'd say my shots 14 days out are at least as good as they were before I upgraded, and when I get things perfect at 4-5days... man thats good stuff.

Definitely buy a scale, it will at least make adjusting to new coffee's a lot easier.

 
Anthony C

Currently pulling:
Malongo Café (Paris, Fr) Single source Mexican.

http://coffeeandneuroscience.wordpress.com/
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