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Assistance please
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Discussions > Espresso > Q and A > Assistance...  
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sleepingtiger
Senior Member


Joined: 21 Mar 2014
Posts: 5
Location: Texas
Expertise: I like coffee

Posted Fri Mar 21, 2014, 8:43am
Subject: Assistance please
 

First off, I am very much new to this forum and coffee. I hope by joining this site, I can maybe one day become a coffee aficionado.

So here is my background.  I am not a coffee person, but my wife is. She loves her Starbucks and Peet's coffee. So to save a few bucks, I bought my wife (who loves her coffee),  a Breville about 5 years ago. It was at that time one of the better machines in the market for home use. I make her a latte several times a week and she is ok with it. Again, I am not a coffee person and wouldn't know what a good coffee taste like. I have done some research and found that my coffee does taste rather sour sometimes or just too bitter.

We are about to redo our kitchen and my wife said she wanted the Miele super automatic espresso machine. At $3200 bucks, its not cheap. I read some reports on it and several people think that its not worth the money and you can get a better counter top unit. I kinda do want to get her a super automatic so she can make her own coffee. Does anyone here suggest a super automatic?

If yes, which model do would you suggest for a $3000 budget?

If no, which automatic unit should i get? I also need money for a new grinder. The grinder I have right now is a capresso infinity, i think i need to upgrade.

So basically, my question is if you had around 2000-3000 for a new espresso + grinder, what would you get?

Thanks for the help
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z0mbie
Senior Member
z0mbie
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 341
Location: Online
Expertise: I live coffee

Posted Fri Mar 21, 2014, 9:09am
Subject: Re: Assistance please
 

Have you looked at the Breville Oracle 980XL?  It's an all-in-one that does automatic grinding, dosing, tamping, volumetric extraction and milk frothing (adjustable).  To make espresso, or coffee, you just press buttons.   There is also a convenient Caffe Americano button that let's you make regular coffee.  It saves you the extra step of dispensing hot water by doing it for you right after the shot.   The nice thing is if you want to move on to playing barista, you can still do it with this machine. It's a legit dual boiler, with a proven track record for enabling people to make great coffee.  And for the person who thinks all that stuff is boring or troublesome, it'll do it for them.. mostly :)

I'd like to believe this machine will give your wife far superior coffee over any superautomatic.   But I have little experience with either.  I've tried many superautomatics and the coffee they produce are not near the quality of coffee prepared by a bonified, coffee-loving barista.  

Anyway the Oracle 980XL is about $2000. Someone here was selling their unopened one for $1950 shipped.   If I was in your shoes, I'd show her this machine..  And save yourself $1500.  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLhNCyn6pjI
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CMIN
Senior Member


Joined: 14 Jun 2012
Posts: 1,356
Location: South FL
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: Crossland CC1
Grinder: Baratza Preciso
Posted Fri Mar 21, 2014, 9:34am
Subject: Re: Assistance please
 

Just judging from what owners have said what I've read, in that price range I don't think you can do better then the Breville Oracle. It basically combines the convince of a super-automatic with very close to the quality of coffee from a semi-auto and stand alone grinder. Superautos are all about convenience. The cool thing about the Oracle is if down the road you wanted to get a separate and really nice grinder, you could do so and improve the coffee even more as it's basically a tricked out Breville Dual Boiler. Superautos have poor temps and stability even high end ones (the Monza is considered the go to for superautos in the home at this price range and even it's coffee is lackluster vs a decent semi-auto and separate grinder), internal grinders suck, their finicky about bean roast, the doses and water are off... hence why espresso is so awful on superautos lol unless you like a gusher under-extracted shot.

I'd def look at the Oracle, if it were me in that situation it's what I would do even if there weren't any reviews yet or anything just based off what it offers
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sleepingtiger
Senior Member


Joined: 21 Mar 2014
Posts: 5
Location: Texas
Expertise: I like coffee

Posted Fri Mar 21, 2014, 11:19am
Subject: Re: Assistance please
 

thanks for the reply. I am sorry if I confused anyone on what i am really looking for.

  1. does a $3200 superautomatic make a good latte like a peet's or starbucks? if so, which one?

  2. if you had a budget of $3000 and you start with nothing, what would you buy?

I am looking at the expobar brewtus and maybe a pasquini grinder.

btw, i am using the plastic tamper that came with the breville. looking at the price, do i need a $200 tamper?
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takeshi
Senior Member
takeshi
Joined: 12 Oct 2002
Posts: 963
Location: Houston
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Alex Duetto 3.0
Grinder: Super Jolly
Roaster: Amaya Roasting
Posted Fri Mar 21, 2014, 12:05pm
Subject: Re: Assistance please
 

This really isn't a good site for superauto recommendations.  A site like Single Serve Coffee is intended for those that prefer convenience above all else but even it is geared more towards the pod/cup systems.  The only superauto I've seen recommended around here is the Quickmill Monza.

sleepingtiger Said:

We are about to redo our kitchen and my wife said she wanted the Miele super automatic espresso machine. At $3200 bucks, its not cheap. I read some reports on it and several people think that its not worth the money and you can get a better counter top unit.

Posted March 21, 2014 link

Of course not.  Worth is highly subjective no matter what the topic.  For any product you'll find those that find it worth it and those that do not.  You can't just randomly poll or read reviews to determine if it is worth it to you.  You need to consider your specific needs/wants.goals/priorities/budget/etc.  Unfortunately, you're not likely to find anyone with first hand experience with the Miele on this site.

sleepingtiger Said:

if you had a budget of $3000 and you start with nothing, what would you buy?

Posted March 21, 2014 link

An "If you...?" question isn't going to help.  Go to the espresso machine subforum.  Read the sticky and give us the info we need to give you suitable recommendations.  You (well, you and your wife) have to determine your priorities and where you're willing to compromise.

sleepingtiger Said:

does a $3200 superautomatic make a good latte like a peet's or starbucks? if so, which one?

Posted March 21, 2014 link

...and that's another problem.  CoffeeGeeks aren't going to consider Starbucks to be good.  You'd be better off asking those that do think it's good.  I'm a latte drinker and I can't stand their bland and flavorless lattes.

Where in Texas are you located?  There are a fair number of Texans on here that can direct you to coffee shops that can really show you what a latte can and should be.  That might help you in your decision making.  If you and your wife can't tell the difference between what a good coffee shop and Starbucks produce and you both value convenience most then a superauto may be the best fit for you.  If you like what a good coffee shop can produce and you're willing to invest the time and effort then a superauto may not be the best fit.  I can understand wanting convenience but it really doesn't take me much time to use my double boiler semiauto to produce 2 lattes for me and my wife each morning before I head out the door.
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CoffeeRon
Senior Member
CoffeeRon
Joined: 26 Apr 2009
Posts: 739
Location: Tacoma Wa.
Expertise: I love coffee

Espresso: Wega Lyra, Europiccola(still...
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Vac Pot: Sunbeam CoffeeMaster
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Roaster: FR SR500,B-1600, SC/TO
Posted Fri Mar 21, 2014, 12:06pm
Subject: Re: Assistance please
 

I would suggest you go to the Espresso Machines area and read the Sticky at the top- it will answer many of your questions, and pose a few more to you.
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takeshi
Senior Member
takeshi
Joined: 12 Oct 2002
Posts: 963
Location: Houston
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Alex Duetto 3.0
Grinder: Super Jolly
Roaster: Amaya Roasting
Posted Fri Mar 21, 2014, 12:31pm
Subject: Re: Assistance please
 

(nm)
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GVDub
Senior Member


Joined: 25 Jan 2008
Posts: 849
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Expertise: I live coffee

Espresso: Londinium I, Arrarex...
Grinder: Gaggia MD85, Dienes Mokka,...
Drip: Behmor Brazen, Abid Clever
Roaster: Behmor 1600
Posted Fri Mar 21, 2014, 12:54pm
Subject: Re: Assistance please
 

Quick answer:

If I were looking for a super-auto in that price range, it would be, without a doubt, the Quickmill Monza Deluxe.

Considering that big-chain coffee not uses super-autos themselves so they don't have to train employees to actually know what they're doing (not that they don't have some employees with a clue, but those folks don't usually stay there that long), it will likely be better than *$ or Peet's or any other chain, especially if you buy better quality beans.

If that's all your looking for, there you go.

Long answer:

As stated above, review the sticky at the top of the Espresso Machines forum and think about the answers to those questions. Since you don't drink coffee, you should actually have your wife do the thinking about the answers, since she'll be the one drinking the results.

I've owned super-autos. I've consumed coffee from very high-end super-autos. The very best espresso i've ever gotten from a super-auto is no better than mediocre compared to what a non-super-auto machine is capable of with an even reasonably skilled operator. So it comes down to quality vs. convenience. I understand that convenience is of higher importance for some folks, but given that with a super-auto you're still having to do a certain amount of cleaning and maintenance, the increase in convenience over grinding, dosing, tamping and pulling for yourself isn't all that great. And the trade-off in quality is. But the balance between the two and which side you come down on? That's up to everyone to decide for themselves
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sleepingtiger
Senior Member


Joined: 21 Mar 2014
Posts: 5
Location: Texas
Expertise: I like coffee

Posted Fri Mar 21, 2014, 1:19pm
Subject: Re: Assistance please
 

yeah, she loves her peet's. but i figured that most of the posters here didn't think much of peets or starbucks.

I live in dallas and would love to try out and learn new ways to make and enjoys latte's.

thanks everyone for your reply, i will go to the other forum and look over the espresso machines.
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CMIN
Senior Member


Joined: 14 Jun 2012
Posts: 1,356
Location: South FL
Expertise: I like coffee

Espresso: Crossland CC1
Grinder: Baratza Preciso
Posted Fri Mar 21, 2014, 2:03pm
Subject: Re: Assistance please
 

You should take her to a good coffee shop or roaster that has a shop. She'll never touch Peets or Charbucks again lol ;) . My wife was the same way, loved her Peets and thought Charbucks was the be all end all of coffee. Till I started making her drinks with fresh roasted coffee shipped to the house. She'll never touch either or anything store bought again now, when we travel especially to Cali alot, we look for good shops/roasters and will even drive out of our way to hit them up. Peets used to be decent back in the day, then they got too big. I can't even stand to drink Charbucks, ice coffee taste like a liquid cigarette, and the flavored drinks are awful and so loaded with junk they don't even resemble coffee any more lol.

Since your also looking at a semi-auto and separate grinder do not even bother with a Superauto, for even half your budget you can get an awesome setup that will only take a couple trys to start to get the hang off (primarily knowing how to dial beans in and steam milk correctly since you want lattes). Fresh beans, and your wife will be one happy gal ;)
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