Posted Thu Sep 9, 2004, 4:47pm Subject: A funny thing happened on the way to the forum...
There are clearly people who are feeling that the off-topics forum is getting in the road of their enjoyment of the site. Others feel that we enjoy the Coffeegeek coffeeshop atmosphere of that forum and should be allowed to do so.
One obvious solution is to give everbody a choice as to whether or not the off-topic posts appear in the new-posts section when they come-in.
What I would like to hear is from people who have knowledge about setting up websites:
How could we do this? A separate link from somewhere or a separate log-in?
Posted Thu Sep 9, 2004, 5:26pm Subject: Re: A funny thing happened on the way to the forum...
jeffmac Said:
There are clearly people who are feeling that the off-topics forum is getting in the road of their enjoyment of the site. Others feel that we enjoy the Coffeegeek coffeeshop atmosphere of that forum and should be allowed to do so.
For my part, it's not so much the off topics as it is the emotionally charged threads and/or posts, rants, that seem to have become the norm, the past few months. We've had several threads locked, members calling other members 'idiots', rants and several posts that, while not necessarily outright rude, are certainly questionable. IOW, if this is the atmosphere I encountered at a coffee shop, I'd walk out. I suppose this is par for the course, once you've attracted such a large group with varying personalities. I also think often people hide behind their computers & say things they would not say to someone's face. (Or if they did, I'm certainly glad I don't have to deal with them in "real life".) Even very innocuous posts get slammed. Just because someone posts a suggestion, someone else should not ask "are you totally insane?"
I can think of one member who never seemed to post except in the emotionally charged threats. (Although I've not seen any posts from that member in the recent months.) I know some people thrive on chaos in their lives. I do not.
In a nutshell, I guess my feeling is that much of the tolerance of, graciousness to and respect for the other members has gone away, by some, to the point where I wish CG had a "kill filter".
Posted Thu Sep 9, 2004, 5:55pm Subject: Re: A funny thing happened on the way to the forum...
I guess Roxiel that it is a product of the site getting bigger. And more diverse, for example in Australia it is considered perfectly acceptable to insult someone grotesquely as a way of showing friendship. (I can't imagine what would happen to someone in an English pub if they walked up to someone and said "Whatcha been up to you silly old b------d"). I do know what would happen on the lower east side!
Apart from appealing to goodwill I don't know how we could "legislate" good manners or even if we could all agree what they are. And then I guess there will always be misunderstandings--computers just have that failing as against face to face contact, and I'm new to this aspect of them myself. Coffeegeek and the Internet are co-eval for me.
At least maybe having an isolated section where some of the more chaotic stuff can be contained might make it easier to stop the rudeness on the on-topic threads. I don't know. But we should try. If people like you are getting tired of it, what hope the rest of us?
Posted Thu Sep 9, 2004, 6:16pm Subject: Re: A funny thing happened on the way to the forum...
Perhaps it is the political season, but I agree there's been a definite uptick in provocative subjects in the Off Topics forum. Here's the first page:
1000+ U.S. troops dead in Iraq
Republicans like Starbucks, Democrats do not
Something terribly wrong in G.W. Bush's America....
Guide to "DUBYA" Supporters: Partial list of the Top 22 'Species'
"Watergate 2" blowing in the wind....
Five out of 10 are pretty obvious attention getters. How this site handles this situation will determine the audience it attracts. Wayne (the site tech support) pointed out this excellent article on the subject: Building Communities with Software. I don't have a great answer, nor a firm opinion at this point. The thought of "censorship" really grates on my sensibilities. Other boards I've participated in didn't have a "new posts" list that combined multiple forums, so their "Rants" forum (and all seem to have one) didn't drown out other discussions.
The Off Topics forum used to be a fun place to enjoy a laugh. Recently it's dominated by political debate. For me, some of it has been thought provoking and interesting. Like Roxie, there has been a few times when I really wished it were easier to "tune it out" (I use updated topics for those moments).
So here's my three suggestions:
Do nothing.
Create a separate forum, "Rants and Raves." It is not in the "new posts" list or "updated topics" list. It is a no man's land. Moderators move "hot potatoes" to this forum.
Add a "chill out" button. Each member can nominate a thread to "chill out" (only one request per month per member, to discourage spoilers). If a thread accumulates 50 chill out requests, it auto-locks for one week (essentially self-moderating).
To address Roxie's concerns about general rudeness, I suppose you could have a similar "chill out" button for members (joking).
Posted Thu Sep 9, 2004, 6:44pm Subject: Re: A funny thing happened on the way to the forum...
If I may make a suggestion - CG threads are much (MUCH) more pleasant when ideas are exchanged in a respectful and friendly way. IMO one should be able to imagine one's self in a nice coffee shop or cafe having pleasant conversation and debate with friends and aquaintances.
The "1,000 US Troops" thread is a perfect example of a conversation with good folks who may disagree, but do so in a civil and respectful manner.
I'm sure there are plenty of places on the WWW where people enjoy blasting and flaming and generally antagonizing each other. Such heated conversations would be best kept at one of those sites.
I would have no objection to keeping a home page link so CG members who wish to engage in combattive dialogue can easily find the way there. EDIT Dan's notion of a "Rants and Raves" area that doesn't enter the new or updated topics lists seems like a very sensible idea as well (for those that enjoy a heated, caffiene-fueled, knock-down, drag-out fight).
Posted Thu Sep 9, 2004, 7:12pm Subject: Re: A funny thing happened on the way to the forum...
JonR10 Said:
If I may make a suggestion - CG threads are much (MUCH) more pleasant when ideas are exchanged in a respectful and friendly way. IMO one should be able to imagine one's self in a nice coffee shop or cafe having pleasant conversation and debate with friends and aquaintances.
I agree. I realize there will always be rude people, even in "real life" but for me, the combination of all the rants/raves/personal attacks/etc along with the rude posts has just been more than I care to be around, lately. Along with Jon's visual, I think it's important for posters to realize that much is left for interpretation since we can't see the body language or hear intonations AND we're of varying ages and cultures. So it's especially important to be polite & respectful when communicating online, especially when you don't know the others very well or they don't know you.
Posted Thu Sep 9, 2004, 7:45pm Subject: Re: A funny thing happened on the way to the forum...
RoxieL Said:
Along with Jon's visual, I think it's important for posters to realize that much is left for interpretation since we can't see the body language or hear intonations AND we're of varying ages and cultures. So it's especially important to be polite & respectful when communicating online, especially when you don't know the others very well or they don't know you.
One obvious solution is to give everbody a choice as to whether or not the off-topic posts appear in the new-posts section when they come-in.
Sounds good, but is it worth the effort/cost involved? -
I find the current off-topics list a complete turn-off as I come to CG partially as an escape from this sort of stuff and if I wasn't so pro free speech, I'd suggest chopping the entire off-topics area. Wonder if there's a political discussion site somewhere currently discussing coffee?
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